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diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/20101209/003192.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/20101209/003192.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..9f2dc99e9 --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/20101209/003192.html @@ -0,0 +1,137 @@ +<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 3.2//EN"> +<HTML> + <HEAD> + <TITLE> [Mageia-discuss] Habemus logo + </TITLE> + <LINK REL="Index" HREF="index.html" > + <LINK REL="made" HREF="mailto:mageia-discuss%40mageia.org?Subject=Re%3A%20%5BMageia-discuss%5D%20Habemus%20logo&In-Reply-To=%3CAANLkTik6Z%3Dyq0r1Tfuy7SF_AE2%2BSQXTEiTF26p9uB6D2%40mail.gmail.com%3E"> + <META NAME="robots" CONTENT="index,nofollow"> + <META http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=us-ascii"> + <LINK REL="Previous" HREF="003190.html"> + <LINK REL="Next" HREF="003193.html"> + </HEAD> + <BODY BGCOLOR="#ffffff"> + <H1>[Mageia-discuss] Habemus logo</H1> + <B>Romain d'Alverny</B> + <A HREF="mailto:mageia-discuss%40mageia.org?Subject=Re%3A%20%5BMageia-discuss%5D%20Habemus%20logo&In-Reply-To=%3CAANLkTik6Z%3Dyq0r1Tfuy7SF_AE2%2BSQXTEiTF26p9uB6D2%40mail.gmail.com%3E" + TITLE="[Mageia-discuss] Habemus logo">rdalverny at gmail.com + </A><BR> + <I>Thu Dec 9 10:57:55 CET 2010</I> + <P><UL> + <LI>Previous message: <A HREF="003190.html">[Mageia-discuss] Habemus logo +</A></li> + <LI>Next message: <A HREF="003193.html">[Mageia-discuss] Habemus logo +</A></li> + <LI> <B>Messages sorted by:</B> + <a href="date.html#3192">[ date ]</a> + <a href="thread.html#3192">[ thread ]</a> + <a href="subject.html#3192">[ subject ]</a> + <a href="author.html#3192">[ author ]</a> + </LI> + </UL> + <HR> +<!--beginarticle--> +<PRE>On Thu, Dec 9, 2010 at 00:55, Hoyt Duff <<A HREF="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-discuss">hoytduff at gmail.com</A>> wrote: +><i> If you are overburdened and need help, you should ask for help: +</I>><i> there is a community out here. +</I> +And as we have started setting up teams (not all of them yet) for +one/two months, we're starting to distribute the work, to the pace we +can delegate and coordinate that. It takes time. + +><i> You, however, feel somehow offended and defensive at my participation. +</I>><i> That approach generally fails to foster wider community participation +</I>><i> over time and inhibits the free exchange of ideas. +</I> +I understand misc' reaction as well. As wobo said, he's been quite +very busy from day 1 and we've been several in this case. It may not +look like it, but keeping a weekly meeting + public update is a kind +of a struggle (but as well because we are eager to see the whole thing +start; in the end, + +You expressed your point of view and although I'm sure it's not, it +can be understood as free criticism. Again, it's a matter of +perception. + +Now, having slept over it, here's a grain of salt to my previous post +(not a contradiction, rather a complement). It's more general than +specific to this logo matter. + +Mageia won't happen/grow/succeed without a cohesive lot of committed +people. It is a community thing. It's not the founding members + a few +versus all the rest; it's not an organisation versus all the other +people. It's a whole. Its governance has been designed so that the +very control of the project/association will go to those that will +have been recognized as the best ones for that job. Wobo said it, it's +a 2-way thing. + +We don't expect this community to be made of passers-by. There will +be; but we expect more of/from people that do care to the point they +will take the time to listen, understand, discuss, draft, experiment, +fail, start over, etc. to provide something more, something better to +the project, as a whole (so that excludes, of course, harsh, non +constructive criticism; but that will happen, we just have to have a +way to manage it). + +So, expecting this from people, and for them to do this, is hard, +sometimes very hard. It may sound a bit "elitist", it is, but in a +good way. Because we crave people to join to coordinate and build this +thing carefully. And that takes a lot. But that's great. + +That's great provided that it is good/rewarding to work/collaborate +together through this - no one wants to participate in something that +does not make one a better person. That it makes us able to deliver, +not only great technology but a good attitude about creation, design, +collaboration, production, delivery. That it makes us all not only +grow as a community, but as individuals as well, within our own other +fields. + +So indeed, again, as a default, we expect the core community to grow +out of very committed, spontaneous, kind, patient and friendly people; +skilled as well of course, but especially eager to learn more/better +from each other to build more/better. + +Ok, it may sound as "we won't recruit/encourage anyone to join, they +just have to prove themselves"; but that's not that: as I said _it is +a grain of salt_. We do, we have to encourage people to join for good +reasons (that's even the very first big thing the marketing team has +as a target), contributors first. We hope Mageia as we exposed it and +managed it to this day is a good set of great reasons. + +That's how/where we're learning at this time. That's why this +postmortem is crucial (and that we expect to do one after each +significant release/action). For it to work, we've go to accept to +listen to open point of views, even harsh ones - that does not prevent +us to defend our own points. We all have to take these from a distance +to better understand the whole picture. + +In this, your point of view is very valuable as well as others +(provided the language/timezone/whatever barriers, let's do it quietly +and carefully). + +Cheers, + +Romain +</PRE> + + +<!--endarticle--> + <HR> + <P><UL> + <!--threads--> + <LI>Previous message: <A HREF="003190.html">[Mageia-discuss] Habemus logo +</A></li> + <LI>Next message: <A HREF="003193.html">[Mageia-discuss] Habemus logo +</A></li> + <LI> <B>Messages sorted by:</B> + <a href="date.html#3192">[ date ]</a> + <a href="thread.html#3192">[ thread ]</a> + <a href="subject.html#3192">[ subject ]</a> + <a href="author.html#3192">[ author ]</a> + </LI> + </UL> + +<hr> +<a href="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-discuss">More information about the Mageia-discuss +mailing list</a><br> +</body></html> |