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diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-dev/2011-July/006642.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-dev/2011-July/006642.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..bd5569e10 --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-dev/2011-July/006642.html @@ -0,0 +1,190 @@ +<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 3.2//EN"> +<HTML> + <HEAD> + <TITLE> [Mageia-dev] [Mageia 2 specifications] Systemd or not systemd + </TITLE> + <LINK REL="Index" HREF="index.html" > + <LINK REL="made" HREF="mailto:mageia-dev%40mageia.org?Subject=Re%3A%20%5BMageia-dev%5D%20%5BMageia%202%20specifications%5D%20Systemd%20or%20not%20systemd&In-Reply-To=%3C4E1F5F0D.2080309%40colin.guthr.ie%3E"> + <META NAME="robots" CONTENT="index,nofollow"> + <META http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=us-ascii"> + <LINK REL="Previous" HREF="006638.html"> + <LINK REL="Next" HREF="006644.html"> + </HEAD> + <BODY BGCOLOR="#ffffff"> + <H1>[Mageia-dev] [Mageia 2 specifications] Systemd or not systemd</H1> + <B>Colin Guthrie</B> + <A HREF="mailto:mageia-dev%40mageia.org?Subject=Re%3A%20%5BMageia-dev%5D%20%5BMageia%202%20specifications%5D%20Systemd%20or%20not%20systemd&In-Reply-To=%3C4E1F5F0D.2080309%40colin.guthr.ie%3E" + TITLE="[Mageia-dev] [Mageia 2 specifications] Systemd or not systemd">mageia at colin.guthr.ie + </A><BR> + <I>Thu Jul 14 23:26:37 CEST 2011</I> + <P><UL> + <LI>Previous message: <A HREF="006638.html">[Mageia-dev] [Mageia 2 specifications] Systemd or not systemd +</A></li> + <LI>Next message: <A HREF="006644.html">[Mageia-dev] [Mageia 2 specifications] Systemd or not systemd +</A></li> + <LI> <B>Messages sorted by:</B> + <a href="date.html#6642">[ date ]</a> + <a href="thread.html#6642">[ thread ]</a> + <a href="subject.html#6642">[ subject ]</a> + <a href="author.html#6642">[ author ]</a> + </LI> + </UL> + <HR> +<!--beginarticle--> +<PRE>'Twas brillig, and Eugeni Dodonov at 14/07/11 02:47 did gyre and gimble: +><i> On Tue, Jul 12, 2011 at 09:48, Colin Guthrie <<A HREF="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-dev">mageia at colin.guthr.ie</A> +</I>><i> <mailto:<A HREF="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-dev">mageia at colin.guthr.ie</A>>> wrote: +</I>><i> +</I>><i> 'Twas brillig, and Eugeni Dodonov at 12/07/11 13:15 did gyre and gimble: +</I>><i> > If nobody objects, I could help with that. Mandriva certainly gave a +</I>><i> > large experience on how to integrate systemd into the system without +</I>><i> > killing traditional sysvinit alternative. +</I>><i> > +</I>><i> > It would also be extremely interested to have native systemd services +</I>><i> > which use most of systemd features (like sound and alsa scripts, which +</I>><i> > we discussed with Colin and Andrey Borzenkov some months ago but never +</I>><i> > got to implement properly). +</I>><i> +</I>><i> Massive +1 for systemd and massive +1 Eugeni wanting to help out! \o/ +</I>><i> +</I>><i> I'll try and help out in bits and bobs too, tho' time is always a +</I>><i> problem! +</I>><i> +</I>><i> +</I>><i> +</I>><i> Ok, some n00b questions arise from my part, sorry if they seem too basic +</I>><i> - I am only catching up with mga style of development :). +</I>><i> +</I>><i> Systemd 30 is out, with lots of nice changes, so I think we should use +</I>><i> it now as we are quite early in the release cycle. It is working on my +</I>><i> machine, but before doing something about it, I prefer to hear opinions :). +</I> +Well, IMO (for what it matters) I'm massive for using it ASAP! + +><i> Firstly, systemdrequires udev >= 172, what is the policy to update it? +</I>><i> According to 'mgarepo maintdb get udev', it has no maintainers, does +</I>><i> anyone objects if I grab/update it as well? +</I> +I think that would be most welcome! + +><i> Secondly, what should be the correct way of supporting systemd in a +</I>><i> package? In Mandriva, I thought on adding a --with flag to +</I>><i> enable/disable systemd, but in most cases it does (almost) nothing. All +</I>><i> services which want to support systemd only need to place their files +</I>><i> into /lib/systemd - and that's it. Should we support opting-out of +</I>><i> systemd in specs? I believe fcrozat is having the same dilemma in SuSE +</I>><i> now as well, and he settled on some common packaging macros. +</I> +IMO, unless something goes horribly wrong with systemd (which I very +seriously doubt will happen - it's actually been amazing to watch this +project from birth to wide adoption) I'd say we just jump right in and +package the units unconditionally. They don't really take up much space +and do nothing if you choose to not use it for the time being. I think +by mga3 we'll likely *only* offer systemd (if not in mga2), so I'd say +putting in effort to opt out now is pretty much not going to be worth it. + +If anyone else feels super strongly to the contrary, speak up now or +forever hold your peace :D + +><i> Almost finally, should the systemd files belong to the main package, the +</I>><i> same way as they do with initscripts-based one (e.g., the package would +</I>><i> provide /lib/systemd/system/%{name}.service together with +</I>><i> %_sysconfig/rc.d/init.d/%{name} for example), with no extra subpackages +</I>><i> or flags - or should all systemd-specific files go into %{name}-systemd +</I>><i> package for example? What do you think? +</I> +I vote to put them in the same place as the initscripts-based ones. As I +predicted above, I reckon it won't take too long for systemd to be the +only system offered and obsoleting all those subpackages would be a bit +of a PITA down the line. And if systemd isn't used those files do +nothing, so no harm done. + +><i> And finally, what does seems to be the best way of starting to use +</I>><i> systemd in cauldron? I have thought on 3 alternatives: +</I>><i> - easy way, only having it packaged, but not +</I>><i> providing/obsoleting/conflicting with sysvinit. This way, it will work +</I>><i> when kernel is booted with init=/bin/systemd (the least invasive way) +</I>><i> - compatible way (like in Mandriva) - it is available, systemd-sysvinit +</I>><i> conflicts with sysvinit, so if someone installs systemd-sysvinit, +</I>><i> sysvinit goes away and systemd is run by default. This seems to be the +</I>><i> most sane way to me (but I could be biased), and it is easiest one for +</I>><i> testing +</I>><i> - ultimate way - systemd provides and obsoletes sysvinit and its +</I>><i> goodies. This way, systemd will be the only one (e.g., highlander +</I>><i> style). This is how fedora did it if I am not mistaken, but I am not +</I>><i> sure if it the best way. +</I>><i> +</I>><i> So, that's it for now from my part.. +</I> +I'd like option 2 please! :) It doesn't exclude using option 1 along +with it (I was doing this for a while), so it's most flexible. + +If all goes well for those testing it, we can vote on whether we jump in +with both feet :) + +That's my take on it anyway! + +:<i>) +</I> +Col + + + +-- + +Colin Guthrie +mageia(at)colin.guthr.ie +<A HREF="http://colin.guthr.ie/">http://colin.guthr.ie/</A> + +Day Job: + Tribalogic Limited [<A HREF="http://www.tribalogic.net/">http://www.tribalogic.net/</A>] +Open Source: + Mageia Contributor [<A HREF="http://www.mageia.org/">http://www.mageia.org/</A>] + PulseAudio Hacker [<A HREF="http://www.pulseaudio.org/">http://www.pulseaudio.org/</A>] + Trac Hacker [<A HREF="http://trac.edgewall.org/">http://trac.edgewall.org/</A>] +</PRE> + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + +<!--endarticle--> + <HR> + <P><UL> + <!--threads--> + <LI>Previous message: <A HREF="006638.html">[Mageia-dev] [Mageia 2 specifications] Systemd or not systemd +</A></li> + <LI>Next message: <A HREF="006644.html">[Mageia-dev] [Mageia 2 specifications] Systemd or not systemd +</A></li> + <LI> <B>Messages sorted by:</B> + <a href="date.html#6642">[ date ]</a> + <a href="thread.html#6642">[ thread ]</a> + <a href="subject.html#6642">[ subject ]</a> + <a href="author.html#6642">[ author ]</a> + </LI> + </UL> + +<hr> +<a href="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-dev">More information about the Mageia-dev +mailing list</a><br> +</body></html> |