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| author | Nicolas Vigier <boklm@mageia.org> | 2013-04-14 13:46:12 +0000 |
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| committer | Nicolas Vigier <boklm@mageia.org> | 2013-04-14 13:46:12 +0000 |
| commit | 1be510f9529cb082f802408b472a77d074b394c0 (patch) | |
| tree | b175f9d5fcb107576dabc768e7bd04d4a3e491a0 /zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20110521/bbc34b05 | |
| parent | fa5098cf210b23ab4f419913e28af7b1b07dafb2 (diff) | |
| download | archives-master.tar archives-master.tar.gz archives-master.tar.bz2 archives-master.tar.xz archives-master.zip | |
Diffstat (limited to 'zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20110521/bbc34b05')
| -rw-r--r-- | zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20110521/bbc34b05/attachment-0001.html | 72 | ||||
| -rw-r--r-- | zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20110521/bbc34b05/attachment.html | 72 |
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diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20110521/bbc34b05/attachment-0001.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20110521/bbc34b05/attachment-0001.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..636f0048a --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20110521/bbc34b05/attachment-0001.html @@ -0,0 +1,72 @@ +<span style="font-size: 14pt; font-family: "Times New Roman";" lang="EN-US">There is also a +script called "tuningdrake" developed from <a href="http://blogdrake.net/">http://blogdrake.net/</a> that +the user could install a lot of non-free stuffs like sun java, adobe acrobat, +etc. </span><span style="font-size: 14pt; font-family: "Times New Roman";">It works on mageia with that code</span><pre class="code"><span style="font-size: 14pt;" lang="EN-US">urpmi <a href="ftp://ftp.blogdrake.net/mandriva/2010.0/free/noarch/Tuningdrake-1.0.3-1bdk2010.0.noarch.rpm">ftp://ftp.blogdrake.net/mandriva/2010.0/free/noarch/Tuningdrake-1.0.3-1bdk2010.0.noarch.rpm</a><br> +<br><br><br>You can read about it from mandriva Brazil wiki at <a href="http://docs.mandriva-br.org/mandriva/utilidades/tuningdrake#instalando_o_tuningdrake">http://docs.mandriva-br.org/mandriva/utilidades/tuningdrake#instalando_o_tuningdrake</a><br> +<br><br><br>cheers.</span></pre><br><br><div class="gmail_quote">2011/5/21 Michael scherer <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:misc@zarb.org">misc@zarb.org</a>></span><br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;"> +<div><div></div><div class="h5">On Sat, May 21, 2011 at 04:59:43PM -0500, Dale Huckeby wrote:<br> +> On Sat, 21 May 2011, Ahmad Samir wrote:<br> +><br> +> >On 21 May 2011 21:46, Renaud (Ron) Olgiati<br> +> ><<a href="mailto:renaud@olgiati-in-paraguay.org">renaud@olgiati-in-paraguay.org</a>> wrote:<br> +> >>Will there be some such thing in place when Mageia is finally launched ?<br> +> >><br> +> ><br> +> >No, simply because there's no need for a tool like that; easyurpmi was<br> +> >mainly used by Mandriva users to add the PLF repos, in Mageia PLF is<br> +> >replaced by the Tainted repo, which is added (but disabled) by<br> +> >default.<br> +><br> +> Simply no need? Maybe I'm misreading you or missing something but this comes<br> +> across as really arrogant in presuming what others (not you!) do or don't need,<br> +> and how and why people have "mainly" used easyurpmi in the past. How do you<br> +> know? Was there a poll that I didn't get included in? I've always found<br> +> easyurpmi very convenient and not just for plf. I guess I didn't realize how<br> +> atypical I was.<br> +<br> +</div></div>Easyurpmi, as I said in the past, suffer from various problems :<br> +<br> +- it is centralized. It is where people fighted to get included or not. Every<br> +group in the past forked ( some without any attribution ) the software to be<br> +listed as repository for their version, because the original maintainer refused<br> +to list every possible variations of every random rpm repositories. Despites having wrote<br> +docs on .urpmi-media file on the wiki, people prefered to reuse easyurpmi out of<br> +some form of cargo culting ( until easyurpmi decided to adopt the system ).<br> +<br> +This caused some frictions in the community, and some divisions due to X instances of the software.<br> +<br> +- the code could have been much better. Olivier wrote it and he was not a php coder, and<br> +neither is Phillipe, the current maintainer. I think that the translation system is<br> +primitive and prone to problem. No one seemed to be motivated to rewrite, despites<br> +people fixing various problem.<br> +<br> +- the core of the system was still "here is a website that a new user cannot find by<br> +itself, that will give command that he doesn't understand, and that he need to type as root,<br> +after asking question that didn't made much sense for him". That's bad on many levels :<br> + - difficult to find for a new user.<br> + - asking to type command as root first, and later "click on a link in your browser and type after your<br> +admin password", which is IMHO quite bad from giving wrong habits to people.<br> + - asking lots of questions, ( fixed later by using a simplified mode, that use rpmdrake or<br> +that fail silently )<br> +<br> +There is also some issue like "it requires a web browser" ( which is highly problematic when you<br> +are in a datacenter, setting up a server ). And "it doesn't use ssl" ( which is rather bad for a site that give you<br> +basically software sources ). This one could be fixed, but that's quite curious that no one<br> +thought of it before. Maybe people do not care about security, and about the content of a file that end<br> +to be read by a software running as root.<br> +<br> +The discoverability issues still exist and could not be fixed because of the nature of PLF/Mandriva.<br> +The bad habits given to users is a direct consequence of the way it work. The power struggle<br> +part too is inherent to the system, and this would become worst if there is a official instance<br> +on Mageia servers.<br> +<br> +Since the discoverability issue should be fixed by simply having tainted disabled by default and maybe<br> +some popup whatever to enable it, I see no reason to suffer from the others problems (<br> +bad habits, power struggle ). People can install a clone of easyurpmi if they want, but I will<br> +oppose on having it on our servers, on having anything like this labelled as official, and<br> +would recommend to people to not deploy it.<br> +<br> +<br> +--<br> +<font color="#888888">Michael Scherer<br> +</font></blockquote></div><br> diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20110521/bbc34b05/attachment.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20110521/bbc34b05/attachment.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..636f0048a --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20110521/bbc34b05/attachment.html @@ -0,0 +1,72 @@ +<span style="font-size: 14pt; font-family: "Times New Roman";" lang="EN-US">There is also a +script called "tuningdrake" developed from <a href="http://blogdrake.net/">http://blogdrake.net/</a> that +the user could install a lot of non-free stuffs like sun java, adobe acrobat, +etc. </span><span style="font-size: 14pt; font-family: "Times New Roman";">It works on mageia with that code</span><pre class="code"><span style="font-size: 14pt;" lang="EN-US">urpmi <a href="ftp://ftp.blogdrake.net/mandriva/2010.0/free/noarch/Tuningdrake-1.0.3-1bdk2010.0.noarch.rpm">ftp://ftp.blogdrake.net/mandriva/2010.0/free/noarch/Tuningdrake-1.0.3-1bdk2010.0.noarch.rpm</a><br> +<br><br><br>You can read about it from mandriva Brazil wiki at <a href="http://docs.mandriva-br.org/mandriva/utilidades/tuningdrake#instalando_o_tuningdrake">http://docs.mandriva-br.org/mandriva/utilidades/tuningdrake#instalando_o_tuningdrake</a><br> +<br><br><br>cheers.</span></pre><br><br><div class="gmail_quote">2011/5/21 Michael scherer <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:misc@zarb.org">misc@zarb.org</a>></span><br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;"> +<div><div></div><div class="h5">On Sat, May 21, 2011 at 04:59:43PM -0500, Dale Huckeby wrote:<br> +> On Sat, 21 May 2011, Ahmad Samir wrote:<br> +><br> +> >On 21 May 2011 21:46, Renaud (Ron) Olgiati<br> +> ><<a href="mailto:renaud@olgiati-in-paraguay.org">renaud@olgiati-in-paraguay.org</a>> wrote:<br> +> >>Will there be some such thing in place when Mageia is finally launched ?<br> +> >><br> +> ><br> +> >No, simply because there's no need for a tool like that; easyurpmi was<br> +> >mainly used by Mandriva users to add the PLF repos, in Mageia PLF is<br> +> >replaced by the Tainted repo, which is added (but disabled) by<br> +> >default.<br> +><br> +> Simply no need? Maybe I'm misreading you or missing something but this comes<br> +> across as really arrogant in presuming what others (not you!) do or don't need,<br> +> and how and why people have "mainly" used easyurpmi in the past. How do you<br> +> know? Was there a poll that I didn't get included in? I've always found<br> +> easyurpmi very convenient and not just for plf. I guess I didn't realize how<br> +> atypical I was.<br> +<br> +</div></div>Easyurpmi, as I said in the past, suffer from various problems :<br> +<br> +- it is centralized. It is where people fighted to get included or not. Every<br> +group in the past forked ( some without any attribution ) the software to be<br> +listed as repository for their version, because the original maintainer refused<br> +to list every possible variations of every random rpm repositories. Despites having wrote<br> +docs on .urpmi-media file on the wiki, people prefered to reuse easyurpmi out of<br> +some form of cargo culting ( until easyurpmi decided to adopt the system ).<br> +<br> +This caused some frictions in the community, and some divisions due to X instances of the software.<br> +<br> +- the code could have been much better. Olivier wrote it and he was not a php coder, and<br> +neither is Phillipe, the current maintainer. I think that the translation system is<br> +primitive and prone to problem. No one seemed to be motivated to rewrite, despites<br> +people fixing various problem.<br> +<br> +- the core of the system was still "here is a website that a new user cannot find by<br> +itself, that will give command that he doesn't understand, and that he need to type as root,<br> +after asking question that didn't made much sense for him". That's bad on many levels :<br> + - difficult to find for a new user.<br> + - asking to type command as root first, and later "click on a link in your browser and type after your<br> +admin password", which is IMHO quite bad from giving wrong habits to people.<br> + - asking lots of questions, ( fixed later by using a simplified mode, that use rpmdrake or<br> +that fail silently )<br> +<br> +There is also some issue like "it requires a web browser" ( which is highly problematic when you<br> +are in a datacenter, setting up a server ). And "it doesn't use ssl" ( which is rather bad for a site that give you<br> +basically software sources ). This one could be fixed, but that's quite curious that no one<br> +thought of it before. Maybe people do not care about security, and about the content of a file that end<br> +to be read by a software running as root.<br> +<br> +The discoverability issues still exist and could not be fixed because of the nature of PLF/Mandriva.<br> +The bad habits given to users is a direct consequence of the way it work. The power struggle<br> +part too is inherent to the system, and this would become worst if there is a official instance<br> +on Mageia servers.<br> +<br> +Since the discoverability issue should be fixed by simply having tainted disabled by default and maybe<br> +some popup whatever to enable it, I see no reason to suffer from the others problems (<br> +bad habits, power struggle ). People can install a clone of easyurpmi if they want, but I will<br> +oppose on having it on our servers, on having anything like this labelled as official, and<br> +would recommend to people to not deploy it.<br> +<br> +<br> +--<br> +<font color="#888888">Michael Scherer<br> +</font></blockquote></div><br> |