[Mageia-dev] Remove upgrade functionnality in installer

Wed Jun 27 12:29:34 CEST 2012

Anne nicolas a écrit :
+>> But using a DVD to upgrade an already installed system is a good way to get
+>> around the fact that many packages, including nonfree firmware, are missing
+>> from the DVD.
+>> If one does a clean install, one has to try to find a lot of missing
+>> packages, because they are no longer installed.  This impacts considerably
+>> the usability of the system.  (Considering what the user had installed.)
+>> All one has to do after the upgrade install, is reboot and do a normal
+>> upgrade with rpmdrake (selecting "all updates" and "all packages"), and
+>> almost everything works well.
+>> (For me upgrade to mga1 worked perfectly.  The last 2 upgrades with mdv had
+>> some problems, due to other factors.  A clean install has always caused me a
+>> lot of problems.)
+>> With a clean install, it can be problematic to find all the missing
+>> packages, as well as missing firmware.
+>>      
+> I'm not saying we remove all upgrade ways as we still have mgaapplet.
+> We experienced *a lot* of problem during QA tests using DVD to
+> upgrade.  Really I don'"t understand your point...
+>    
+
+Well maybe I'm not understanding your proposal.  Initially I thought it 
+was to remove the update option at the end of the upgrade process with 
+the DVD.
+
+Then a post earlier in this thread said that you didn't mean that, and 
+seemed to say that you were suggesting removing the upgrade install 
+option with the DVD, leaving only the clean install.
+If so, I am strongly opposed, as in my experience, for the reasons 
+cited, it has been by far the best upgrade path for myself, and I'm sure 
+for many others.
+
+However, maybe I'm misunderstanding your proposal ?
+
+Maybe the introduction of systemd introduced a one-time transition 
+problem which will not normally be encountered with a DVD upgrade install ?
+
+>> Note that I don't use mgaapplet after an upgrade install, since it doesn't
+>> give me all the information I want, to help me decide if I should drop some
+>> packages that were installed.
+>>      
+> This is not the role of this tool.
+>    
+
+Sorry, just trying to put my approach in context.
+
+>> It may be that using mgaapplet after an upgrade install is the weak link in
+>> the chain.
+>> And certainly urpmi is not a convenient tool at this point.  (Although I use
+>> it a lot at other times.)
+>>      
+> So because mgaapplet is buggy for upgrades, we should just let it down
+> and use DVD ?
+>    
+
+That is not the same thing as saying that we should *prevent* using the 
+DVD for upgrades.
+In any case, with the reliability of Internet connexions available at my 
+location, it is highly unlikely that I could make an upgrade without the 
+DVD.  And during a DVD upgrade, I don't have Internet access.  (My 
+Internet supplier usually cuts the connexion if not active for 5 
+minutes, which always happens with a DVD upgrade.)
+
+>> Note also that with upgrade install, even firmware that is missing from the
+>> release (and not only the DVD) remains installed.  So there are cases where
+>> an upgrade install necessarily produces a better functioning system.
+>>
+>> So in sum, in my view, removing upgrade install for DVDs would be an
+>> important regression.
+>> But maybe we should suggest rebooting and using rpmdrake after such an
+>> install.
+>>      
+> This is non sense... Either the upgrade tool does its job properly or
+> not... How can we say Mageia is easy when you propose such process?
+>    
+
+Sorry, but I think that even the least computer-savy user could easily 
+use this approach.
+Simply
+1) Do upgrade with DVD
+2) Reboot
+3) Do update with MCC/software/package_installer (rpmdrake) or 
+update_system (mgaapplet)
+
+Since an upgrade install only removes packages that are replaced, 
+nonfree firmware stays installed. Also packages not on the DVD stay 
+installed, even though not updated until step 3.
+
+Note that on Microsoft systems, it is generally recommended to reboot 
+after installing, even for relatively minor upgrades.  Instead of only 
+after a release upgrade.
+
+If the user has reliable Internet access during upgrade, of course it 
+would be advantageous to do it in one step.
+
+Note also that at least in North America, users can usually download a 
+DVD for free at their local library, even if they don't have a good 
+Internet connexion at home.  And in other regions, users could obtain a 
+copy of the DVD without having to download it themselves.
+So the DVD upgrade install has its' place.
+
+Regards :)
+
+-- 
+André
+
+