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diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/082431ac/attachment-0001.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/082431ac/attachment-0001.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..baa395d77 --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/082431ac/attachment-0001.html @@ -0,0 +1,18 @@ +<br>2010/9/26 Kristoffer Grundström <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:kristoffer.grundstrom1983@gmail.com">kristoffer.grundstrom1983@gmail.com</a>></span><br><div class="gmail_quote"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;"> + + + + + + + <div bgcolor="#ffffff" text="#000000"> + Why not create a new format with the best of both worlds (if + possible)?<br> + <br> + .mageia ?<br> + <br> + [...]</div></blockquote><div> </div></div>Creating a new format is not that easy (though not impossible). Current .rpm or .deb are package formats which started development several years ago. Consider also that switching to another package format would require re-training for the packagers who might be be used to the .spec file only.<br> +<br>From technical point of view we have to distinguish the package format, which might be .deb, or .rpm from the package frontends (apt, urpmi, yum, emerge, etc.) which retrieves packages and their dependency packages from the repositories. Actually even on mandriva, some alternative frontend to urpmi can be used (IIRC there is "smart"). Speaking about frontends, I had the "feeling" that apt bundled with .deb was a little bit faster than urpmi+rpm, especially on global upgrades of a whole distro on not so new hardware (e.g. an i586...), i.e. upgrading for instance from a mandriva 2010.0 to a 2010.1 or from a ubuntu 9.04 to 9.10. But maybe it's because .deb is doing fewer checks on files, dunno. Remaining on the .rpm world, the bundle urpmi+rpm seems to me also faster than yum+rpm.<br> +<br>IMHO it could be also taken under advisement the rpm5 format (<a href="http://www.rpm5.org">http://www.rpm5.org</a>), that someone already cited for mandriva some time ago. IIRC it should be faster than rpm4, and would allow parallel package installation.<br> +<br>If comparisons should be made for a decision, maybe on the wiki it could be added a table with the basic features of such tools (e.g. performance, LSB compliance, coerency, update, docs, compression, etc.), and the advantage of switching to a new one or a missed feature.<br> +<br>G.<br><br> diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/082431ac/attachment.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/082431ac/attachment.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..baa395d77 --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/082431ac/attachment.html @@ -0,0 +1,18 @@ +<br>2010/9/26 Kristoffer Grundström <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:kristoffer.grundstrom1983@gmail.com">kristoffer.grundstrom1983@gmail.com</a>></span><br><div class="gmail_quote"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;"> + + + + + + + <div bgcolor="#ffffff" text="#000000"> + Why not create a new format with the best of both worlds (if + possible)?<br> + <br> + .mageia ?<br> + <br> + [...]</div></blockquote><div> </div></div>Creating a new format is not that easy (though not impossible). Current .rpm or .deb are package formats which started development several years ago. Consider also that switching to another package format would require re-training for the packagers who might be be used to the .spec file only.<br> +<br>From technical point of view we have to distinguish the package format, which might be .deb, or .rpm from the package frontends (apt, urpmi, yum, emerge, etc.) which retrieves packages and their dependency packages from the repositories. Actually even on mandriva, some alternative frontend to urpmi can be used (IIRC there is "smart"). Speaking about frontends, I had the "feeling" that apt bundled with .deb was a little bit faster than urpmi+rpm, especially on global upgrades of a whole distro on not so new hardware (e.g. an i586...), i.e. upgrading for instance from a mandriva 2010.0 to a 2010.1 or from a ubuntu 9.04 to 9.10. But maybe it's because .deb is doing fewer checks on files, dunno. Remaining on the .rpm world, the bundle urpmi+rpm seems to me also faster than yum+rpm.<br> +<br>IMHO it could be also taken under advisement the rpm5 format (<a href="http://www.rpm5.org">http://www.rpm5.org</a>), that someone already cited for mandriva some time ago. IIRC it should be faster than rpm4, and would allow parallel package installation.<br> +<br>If comparisons should be made for a decision, maybe on the wiki it could be added a table with the basic features of such tools (e.g. performance, LSB compliance, coerency, update, docs, compression, etc.), and the advantage of switching to a new one or a missed feature.<br> +<br>G.<br><br> diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/0a426067/attachment-0001.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/0a426067/attachment-0001.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..04e8aa207 --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/0a426067/attachment-0001.html @@ -0,0 +1,12 @@ +<div class="gmail_quote">2010/9/27 Morgan Leijström <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:fri@tribun.eu">fri@tribun.eu</a>></span><br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;"> +Den 2010-09-26 18:58:22 skrev Wolfgang Bornath:<br> +<br> +> Right now I'm using googlemail with the mailing lists and it is<br> +> getting more chaotic every hour.<br> +<br> +Never tried googlemail so I am not sure what is chaotic.<br> +However, i say:<br></blockquote><div> <br>[...]<br><br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;"> +<font color="#888888"> +/Morgan<br> +</font></blockquote></div><br><br>As already said several on this same Mailing List : <b>please don't break the threads !<br></b><br>Thank you on behalf of people who try to read the incredible number of email which arrives on this list...<br clear="all"> +<br>-- <br>DjeZAeL / Elodie<br> diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/0a426067/attachment.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/0a426067/attachment.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..04e8aa207 --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/0a426067/attachment.html @@ -0,0 +1,12 @@ +<div class="gmail_quote">2010/9/27 Morgan Leijström <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:fri@tribun.eu">fri@tribun.eu</a>></span><br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;"> +Den 2010-09-26 18:58:22 skrev Wolfgang Bornath:<br> +<br> +> Right now I'm using googlemail with the mailing lists and it is<br> +> getting more chaotic every hour.<br> +<br> +Never tried googlemail so I am not sure what is chaotic.<br> +However, i say:<br></blockquote><div> <br>[...]<br><br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;"> +<font color="#888888"> +/Morgan<br> +</font></blockquote></div><br><br>As already said several on this same Mailing List : <b>please don't break the threads !<br></b><br>Thank you on behalf of people who try to read the incredible number of email which arrives on this list...<br clear="all"> +<br>-- <br>DjeZAeL / Elodie<br> diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/0b299832/attachment-0001.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/0b299832/attachment-0001.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..5480238ae --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/0b299832/attachment-0001.html @@ -0,0 +1,4 @@ +<html><head></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><a href="http://mageia-se.org">http://mageia-se.org</a> is now online.<div>Its far from finished but some of the members on <a href="http://mandriva-se.org">mandriva-se.org</a> has been pushing me to get something up around mageia instead.</div><div>The base of the site is buddypress with a few modifications and i'll add a few more patches soon but the main thought of the site</div><div>is to offer the social aspect since i know thats something many users have missed on other community-sites i've been running.</div><div><br></div><div>Hows the work coming along for the official Mageia website?</div><div><div> +<span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Georgia; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; font-size: medium; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Georgia; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; font-size: medium; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: medium; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: medium; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; "><div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><br></div><div>----</div><div><br></div><div>Betygsätt gärna mitt mail!</div><div><a href="http://responsio.se/foretag/stockholm-next-generation-web/david-v-wallin/">http://responsio.se/foretag/stockholm-next-generation-web/david-v-wallin/</a></div><div><br></div><div>----</div><div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline">Best Regards / Vänligen ,</div><div><br></div><div>Stockholm Next Generation Web</div><div>David V. Wallin</div><div>+46 (0)8 4100 39 82</div><div><a href="http://www.ngweb.se">http://www.ngweb.se</a></div><div><a href="mailto:david@ngweb.se">david@ngweb.se</a></div><div><br></div></div></span><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"></span><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"></span></span> +</div> +<br></div></body></html>
\ No newline at end of file diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/0b299832/attachment.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/0b299832/attachment.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..5480238ae --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/0b299832/attachment.html @@ -0,0 +1,4 @@ +<html><head></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><a href="http://mageia-se.org">http://mageia-se.org</a> is now online.<div>Its far from finished but some of the members on <a href="http://mandriva-se.org">mandriva-se.org</a> has been pushing me to get something up around mageia instead.</div><div>The base of the site is buddypress with a few modifications and i'll add a few more patches soon but the main thought of the site</div><div>is to offer the social aspect since i know thats something many users have missed on other community-sites i've been running.</div><div><br></div><div>Hows the work coming along for the official Mageia website?</div><div><div> +<span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Georgia; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; font-size: medium; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Georgia; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; font-size: medium; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: medium; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: medium; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; "><div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><br></div><div>----</div><div><br></div><div>Betygsätt gärna mitt mail!</div><div><a href="http://responsio.se/foretag/stockholm-next-generation-web/david-v-wallin/">http://responsio.se/foretag/stockholm-next-generation-web/david-v-wallin/</a></div><div><br></div><div>----</div><div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline">Best Regards / Vänligen ,</div><div><br></div><div>Stockholm Next Generation Web</div><div>David V. Wallin</div><div>+46 (0)8 4100 39 82</div><div><a href="http://www.ngweb.se">http://www.ngweb.se</a></div><div><a href="mailto:david@ngweb.se">david@ngweb.se</a></div><div><br></div></div></span><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"></span><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"></span></span> +</div> +<br></div></body></html>
\ No newline at end of file diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/11fdef89/attachment-0001.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/11fdef89/attachment-0001.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..c75ac6ee5 --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/11fdef89/attachment-0001.html @@ -0,0 +1,52 @@ +<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN"> +<html> +<head> + <meta content="text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1" + http-equiv="Content-Type"> + <title></title> +</head> +<body text="#000000" bgcolor="#ffffff"> +Le 27/09/2010 10:10, Jean-François BELLANGER a écrit : +<blockquote cite="mid:245081.77799.qm@web27305.mail.ukl.yahoo.com" + type="cite"> + <style type="text/css"><!-- DIV {margin:0px;} --></style> + <div + style="font-family: times new roman,new york,times,serif; font-size: 12pt;"> + <div>Pour moi cette idée est tous sauf débile, d'ailleurs j'avais +fait la même reflexion il y a 2 ans dans les ideas mandriva.<br> + <br> +Le principe existe dans un sens (rpm ---> deb) par le truchement de +"alien" pourquoi ne pas le faire dans l'autre sens et allez plus loin +en intégrant nativement le procédé à la distro.<br> + <br> +Je ne crois qu'un utilisateur néophite ce pose la question de savoir si +il doit utiliser un paquet rpm ou deb ou truc venu de l'espace.....<br> + <br> +PS : J'ai d'ailleurs fais la même reflexion vis à vis de wine qui pour +moi devrait être fondu dans la distro pour prendre en charge les .exe +car une fois de plus l'utilisateur lambda (comme beaucoup des profs et +élèves que je cotoie) se fiche du nom du sytème. Ils veulent que se +soit beau et que sa fonctionne sans avoir a y passer des heures en +documentation et essai. PEUT ON LEUR EN VOULOIR ???<br> + <br> +Donc pour moi +1 :-)<br> + </div> + <br> + </div> +</blockquote> +As said before, please : <br> + use the langage chose for the list (english here)<br> + do not top-post<br> + remove non-pertinent parts of the previous message <br> +<br> +Thank you <br> +<br> +Marianne / Jehane<br> +<br> +<pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">-- +Marianne (Jehane) Lombard +Mandriva User - Mageia french translation team +Inside every fat girl, there is a thin girl waiting to get out (and a lot of chocolate) - Terry Pratchett +</pre> +</body> +</html> diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/11fdef89/attachment.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/11fdef89/attachment.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..c75ac6ee5 --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/11fdef89/attachment.html @@ -0,0 +1,52 @@ +<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN"> +<html> +<head> + <meta content="text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1" + http-equiv="Content-Type"> + <title></title> +</head> +<body text="#000000" bgcolor="#ffffff"> +Le 27/09/2010 10:10, Jean-François BELLANGER a écrit : +<blockquote cite="mid:245081.77799.qm@web27305.mail.ukl.yahoo.com" + type="cite"> + <style type="text/css"><!-- DIV {margin:0px;} --></style> + <div + style="font-family: times new roman,new york,times,serif; font-size: 12pt;"> + <div>Pour moi cette idée est tous sauf débile, d'ailleurs j'avais +fait la même reflexion il y a 2 ans dans les ideas mandriva.<br> + <br> +Le principe existe dans un sens (rpm ---> deb) par le truchement de +"alien" pourquoi ne pas le faire dans l'autre sens et allez plus loin +en intégrant nativement le procédé à la distro.<br> + <br> +Je ne crois qu'un utilisateur néophite ce pose la question de savoir si +il doit utiliser un paquet rpm ou deb ou truc venu de l'espace.....<br> + <br> +PS : J'ai d'ailleurs fais la même reflexion vis à vis de wine qui pour +moi devrait être fondu dans la distro pour prendre en charge les .exe +car une fois de plus l'utilisateur lambda (comme beaucoup des profs et +élèves que je cotoie) se fiche du nom du sytème. Ils veulent que se +soit beau et que sa fonctionne sans avoir a y passer des heures en +documentation et essai. PEUT ON LEUR EN VOULOIR ???<br> + <br> +Donc pour moi +1 :-)<br> + </div> + <br> + </div> +</blockquote> +As said before, please : <br> + use the langage chose for the list (english here)<br> + do not top-post<br> + remove non-pertinent parts of the previous message <br> +<br> +Thank you <br> +<br> +Marianne / Jehane<br> +<br> +<pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">-- +Marianne (Jehane) Lombard +Mandriva User - Mageia french translation team +Inside every fat girl, there is a thin girl waiting to get out (and a lot of chocolate) - Terry Pratchett +</pre> +</body> +</html> diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/14fa11f7/attachment-0001.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/14fa11f7/attachment-0001.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..1311c1d52 --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/14fa11f7/attachment-0001.html @@ -0,0 +1,4 @@ +<IMHO><br>There is no perfect tool as there is no real reason to switch from .rpm to .deb or viceversa.<br>I have always wondered, though there are many open source projects free to derive or contribute, why people prefer to make it again and again from scratch?<br> +There are some issues in any, but we could also find at least two suitable for our needs.<br>Let's polish existent tools until they fit our needs.<br>urpmi is good enough. Let's fix it where is wrong, let's add new features when needed.<br> +Alternately, let contribute with some other tools until they are accepted, if they are worthy, they'll be.<br>Let's focus on real problems. There is no distro yet, let's find what we expect from the new one. Let's do it.<br> +We need to forget about fashion if there are no real arguments to change something.<br>If something is not broken, don't fix it.<br></IMHO><br><br> diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/14fa11f7/attachment.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/14fa11f7/attachment.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..1311c1d52 --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/14fa11f7/attachment.html @@ -0,0 +1,4 @@ +<IMHO><br>There is no perfect tool as there is no real reason to switch from .rpm to .deb or viceversa.<br>I have always wondered, though there are many open source projects free to derive or contribute, why people prefer to make it again and again from scratch?<br> +There are some issues in any, but we could also find at least two suitable for our needs.<br>Let's polish existent tools until they fit our needs.<br>urpmi is good enough. Let's fix it where is wrong, let's add new features when needed.<br> +Alternately, let contribute with some other tools until they are accepted, if they are worthy, they'll be.<br>Let's focus on real problems. There is no distro yet, let's find what we expect from the new one. Let's do it.<br> +We need to forget about fashion if there are no real arguments to change something.<br>If something is not broken, don't fix it.<br></IMHO><br><br> diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/26530221/attachment-0001.vcf b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/26530221/attachment-0001.vcf new file mode 100644 index 000000000..ab0a909d8 --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/26530221/attachment-0001.vcf @@ -0,0 +1,11 @@ +begin:vcard +fn:David Naura +n:Naura;David +org:Lindom EURL +adr:;;L'Iris 12 ch de Beauregard;Aix en PRovence;;13100;France +email;internet:david.naura@lindom.fr +tel;work:06 11 85 11 22 +url:http://www.lindom.fr +version:2.1 +end:vcard + diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/26530221/attachment.vcf b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/26530221/attachment.vcf new file mode 100644 index 000000000..ab0a909d8 --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/26530221/attachment.vcf @@ -0,0 +1,11 @@ +begin:vcard +fn:David Naura +n:Naura;David +org:Lindom EURL +adr:;;L'Iris 12 ch de Beauregard;Aix en PRovence;;13100;France +email;internet:david.naura@lindom.fr +tel;work:06 11 85 11 22 +url:http://www.lindom.fr +version:2.1 +end:vcard + diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/30a779a9/attachment-0001.bin b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/30a779a9/attachment-0001.bin Binary files differnew file mode 100644 index 000000000..e0ed671be --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/30a779a9/attachment-0001.bin diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/30a779a9/attachment-0001.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/30a779a9/attachment-0001.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..f6883d910 --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/30a779a9/attachment-0001.html @@ -0,0 +1,21 @@ +<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">2010/9/27 Anne nicolas <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:ennael1@gmail.com">ennael1@gmail.com</a>></span><br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;"> +2010/9/27 Juan Carlos de la Cruz <<a href="mailto:pcboltzmann@gmail.com">pcboltzmann@gmail.com</a>>:<br> +<div><div></div><div class="h5">> Hi!<br> +><br> +> I've observed that the Mageia project's donations page<br> +> (<a href="http://donation.mageia.org/" target="_blank">http://donation.mageia.org/</a>) has currently been translated to most of the<br> +> languages. However it is not available in Spanish yet.<br> +><br> +> Would you be interested in my translation to Spanish language? If you are<br> +> so, how could I send it? Would it be OK to email it to this ML as an<br> +</div></div>> attached html file? contribution<br> +<br> +It's ok. Thanks for you<br> +<br></blockquote><div><br>Here you are! <br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;"> +<br> +<br> +<br> +--<br> +-------<br> +<font color="#888888">Anne<br> +</font></blockquote></div><br> diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/30a779a9/attachment.bin b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/30a779a9/attachment.bin Binary files differnew file mode 100644 index 000000000..e0ed671be --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/30a779a9/attachment.bin diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/30a779a9/attachment.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/30a779a9/attachment.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..f6883d910 --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/30a779a9/attachment.html @@ -0,0 +1,21 @@ +<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">2010/9/27 Anne nicolas <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:ennael1@gmail.com">ennael1@gmail.com</a>></span><br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;"> +2010/9/27 Juan Carlos de la Cruz <<a href="mailto:pcboltzmann@gmail.com">pcboltzmann@gmail.com</a>>:<br> +<div><div></div><div class="h5">> Hi!<br> +><br> +> I've observed that the Mageia project's donations page<br> +> (<a href="http://donation.mageia.org/" target="_blank">http://donation.mageia.org/</a>) has currently been translated to most of the<br> +> languages. However it is not available in Spanish yet.<br> +><br> +> Would you be interested in my translation to Spanish language? If you are<br> +> so, how could I send it? Would it be OK to email it to this ML as an<br> +</div></div>> attached html file? contribution<br> +<br> +It's ok. Thanks for you<br> +<br></blockquote><div><br>Here you are! <br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;"> +<br> +<br> +<br> +--<br> +-------<br> +<font color="#888888">Anne<br> +</font></blockquote></div><br> diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/3eaf726e/attachment-0001.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/3eaf726e/attachment-0001.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..96fde2572 --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/3eaf726e/attachment-0001.html @@ -0,0 +1,27 @@ +<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN"> +<html> + <head> + <meta content="text/html; charset=UTF-8" http-equiv="Content-Type"> + </head> + <body text="#000000" bgcolor="#ffffff"> + 27.09.2010 00:29, atilla ontas kirjutas:<br> + <blockquote + cite="mid:AANLkTi=e7QpumfbCMOJ7e06_u3u4dBwyST+N0rxb20sU@mail.gmail.com" + type="cite"> + <pre wrap="">INsteadf cussing rpm or deb package formats w should consider to use +apt-rpm like PclinuxOs does. Using synaptic and apt wolud be wonderful +</pre> + </blockquote> + <font face="Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif">Hey,<br> + <br> + can you please stop this deb vs rpm battle. urpm* is one of the + reasons why Mandriva is what it is, it's a brilliant tool and @ + command line it kicks apt's butt. Dropping urpm* would be + pointless and i'm quite sure it won't happen. So please stop + filling my mailbox ;)<br> + <br> + --<br> + Sander <br> + </font> + </body> +</html> diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/3eaf726e/attachment.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/3eaf726e/attachment.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..96fde2572 --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/3eaf726e/attachment.html @@ -0,0 +1,27 @@ +<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN"> +<html> + <head> + <meta content="text/html; charset=UTF-8" http-equiv="Content-Type"> + </head> + <body text="#000000" bgcolor="#ffffff"> + 27.09.2010 00:29, atilla ontas kirjutas:<br> + <blockquote + cite="mid:AANLkTi=e7QpumfbCMOJ7e06_u3u4dBwyST+N0rxb20sU@mail.gmail.com" + type="cite"> + <pre wrap="">INsteadf cussing rpm or deb package formats w should consider to use +apt-rpm like PclinuxOs does. Using synaptic and apt wolud be wonderful +</pre> + </blockquote> + <font face="Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif">Hey,<br> + <br> + can you please stop this deb vs rpm battle. urpm* is one of the + reasons why Mandriva is what it is, it's a brilliant tool and @ + command line it kicks apt's butt. Dropping urpm* would be + pointless and i'm quite sure it won't happen. So please stop + filling my mailbox ;)<br> + <br> + --<br> + Sander <br> + </font> + </body> +</html> diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/624efc6b/attachment-0001.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/624efc6b/attachment-0001.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..f1a1c6220 --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/624efc6b/attachment-0001.html @@ -0,0 +1,24 @@ +<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN"> +<html> + <head> + <meta content="text/html; charset=UTF-8" http-equiv="Content-Type"> + </head> + <body text="#000000" bgcolor="#ffffff"> + 27.09.2010 15:48, Renaud (Ron) OLGIATI kirjutas: + <blockquote + cite="mid:201009270848.59411.renaud@olgiati-in-paraguay.org" + type="cite"> + <pre wrap="">Dare I offer a suggestion aimed at those listers who speak/write little +English: could it be all right for them to post their best effort in English, +_and_ also post in their native language ? +</pre> + </blockquote> + <font face="Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif">I don't think it's a good + idea. Bad english is still better than another language that i + don't understand at all.<br> + <br> + --<br> + Sander<br> + </font> + </body> +</html> diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/624efc6b/attachment.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/624efc6b/attachment.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..f1a1c6220 --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/624efc6b/attachment.html @@ -0,0 +1,24 @@ +<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN"> +<html> + <head> + <meta content="text/html; charset=UTF-8" http-equiv="Content-Type"> + </head> + <body text="#000000" bgcolor="#ffffff"> + 27.09.2010 15:48, Renaud (Ron) OLGIATI kirjutas: + <blockquote + cite="mid:201009270848.59411.renaud@olgiati-in-paraguay.org" + type="cite"> + <pre wrap="">Dare I offer a suggestion aimed at those listers who speak/write little +English: could it be all right for them to post their best effort in English, +_and_ also post in their native language ? +</pre> + </blockquote> + <font face="Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif">I don't think it's a good + idea. Bad english is still better than another language that i + don't understand at all.<br> + <br> + --<br> + Sander<br> + </font> + </body> +</html> diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/6dedd533/attachment-0001.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/6dedd533/attachment-0001.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..e18c5c558 --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/6dedd533/attachment-0001.html @@ -0,0 +1,4 @@ +Hi!<br><br>I've observed that the Mageia project's donations page (<a href="http://donation.mageia.org/" target="_blank">http://donation.mageia.org/</a>) has currently been translated to most of the languages. However it is not available in Spanish yet.<br> + +<br>Would you be interested in my translation to Spanish language? If +you are so, how could I send it? Would it be OK to email it to this ML as an attached html file?<br><br>Cheers diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/6dedd533/attachment.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/6dedd533/attachment.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..e18c5c558 --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/6dedd533/attachment.html @@ -0,0 +1,4 @@ +Hi!<br><br>I've observed that the Mageia project's donations page (<a href="http://donation.mageia.org/" target="_blank">http://donation.mageia.org/</a>) has currently been translated to most of the languages. However it is not available in Spanish yet.<br> + +<br>Would you be interested in my translation to Spanish language? If +you are so, how could I send it? Would it be OK to email it to this ML as an attached html file?<br><br>Cheers diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/7693c57a/attachment-0001.asc b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/7693c57a/attachment-0001.asc new file mode 100644 index 000000000..49e6a0e09 --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/7693c57a/attachment-0001.asc @@ -0,0 +1,7 @@ +-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- +Version: GnuPG v1.4.10 (GNU/Linux) + +iEYEABECAAYFAkyf+E0ACgkQCgaJQr67OPucRQCfcp6QvifCtGWdsYc/TcvEXZkb +X40An3BbK/t9FM+Lo/qcn8jqcUncdyxm +=NRx4 +-----END PGP SIGNATURE----- diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/7693c57a/attachment.asc b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/7693c57a/attachment.asc new file mode 100644 index 000000000..49e6a0e09 --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/7693c57a/attachment.asc @@ -0,0 +1,7 @@ +-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- +Version: GnuPG v1.4.10 (GNU/Linux) + +iEYEABECAAYFAkyf+E0ACgkQCgaJQr67OPucRQCfcp6QvifCtGWdsYc/TcvEXZkb +X40An3BbK/t9FM+Lo/qcn8jqcUncdyxm +=NRx4 +-----END PGP SIGNATURE----- diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/80b5af4a/attachment-0001.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/80b5af4a/attachment-0001.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..bd44fd677 --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/80b5af4a/attachment-0001.html @@ -0,0 +1,14 @@ +<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">2010/9/27 isadora <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:isis2000@gmail.com">isis2000@gmail.com</a>></span><br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;"> +<div class="im"><br><div class="gmail_quote"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;"> +Stop this discussion that is useless, please.<br> +<div><div></div><div><br> +--<br> +Sandro Cazzaniga<br> +Bashburn hacker (<a href="http://bashburn.dose.se/" target="_blank">http://bashburn.dose.se/</a>)<br> +Mageia Contributor (<a href="http://www.mageia.org/fr/" target="_blank">http://www.mageia.org/fr/</a>)<br> +Serial Blogger (<a href="http://twitter.com/Kharec" target="_blank">http://twitter.com/Kharec</a>)<br> +Developer (Perl, Bash, C)<br> +Vice President, secretary and member of CA of Alolise<br> +(<a href="http://www.alolise.org" target="_blank">http://www.alolise.org</a>)<br> +</div></div></blockquote></div><br><br clear="all"><br></div>Exactly that, spend energy in more important things.<br></blockquote><div><br>With all the respect, but I don't like this tone of shutting up people, who might have a less technical skills, especially in a phase of brainstorming where everyone show entusiasm on partecipating even with the most crazy idea, and also because the trolling level has not yet been reached. Sometimes a brilliant idea might come or be inspired even from the most dumbest suggestion.<br> +<br>Bye<br>Giuseppe.<br><br></div></div> diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/80b5af4a/attachment.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/80b5af4a/attachment.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..bd44fd677 --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/80b5af4a/attachment.html @@ -0,0 +1,14 @@ +<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">2010/9/27 isadora <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:isis2000@gmail.com">isis2000@gmail.com</a>></span><br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;"> +<div class="im"><br><div class="gmail_quote"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;"> +Stop this discussion that is useless, please.<br> +<div><div></div><div><br> +--<br> +Sandro Cazzaniga<br> +Bashburn hacker (<a href="http://bashburn.dose.se/" target="_blank">http://bashburn.dose.se/</a>)<br> +Mageia Contributor (<a href="http://www.mageia.org/fr/" target="_blank">http://www.mageia.org/fr/</a>)<br> +Serial Blogger (<a href="http://twitter.com/Kharec" target="_blank">http://twitter.com/Kharec</a>)<br> +Developer (Perl, Bash, C)<br> +Vice President, secretary and member of CA of Alolise<br> +(<a href="http://www.alolise.org" target="_blank">http://www.alolise.org</a>)<br> +</div></div></blockquote></div><br><br clear="all"><br></div>Exactly that, spend energy in more important things.<br></blockquote><div><br>With all the respect, but I don't like this tone of shutting up people, who might have a less technical skills, especially in a phase of brainstorming where everyone show entusiasm on partecipating even with the most crazy idea, and also because the trolling level has not yet been reached. Sometimes a brilliant idea might come or be inspired even from the most dumbest suggestion.<br> +<br>Bye<br>Giuseppe.<br><br></div></div> diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/824696d2/attachment-0001.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/824696d2/attachment-0001.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..94ae8614e --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/824696d2/attachment-0001.html @@ -0,0 +1,9 @@ +<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">2010/9/26 Sascha Schneider <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:schneider@zawm.be">schneider@zawm.be</a>></span><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;"> +I totally agree to that and I hope Mageia will make this happen.<br><br>But I also agree that at this time Mageia has to saddle as a fork, structures have to be build, etc.<br> +<br>Plus, we wouldn't use Mandriva if we don't like the way it works. So no need to change to deb or make Gnome the primer Desktop Env. or stuff like that <br><br>My dream would be a very User and Admin friendly Disto<br> + +<br>One Installer CD for Desktop Dualarch - metapacks for the desktop env <br>One Installer CD for a Serverversion inkl. LXDE + MMC-base and metapaks for some spezial apps inkl. the MMC modules (and pulse)<br>One Installer CD for a Virtualserver using f.e. OpenVZ and a MMC based webui and some community templates<br> + +<br>In my opinion with this simple trippelisation you can arrange all kind of home, business, school, multimedia, netbook ... structures you ever imagine all with one Distro.<br></blockquote><div><br></div><div>That's very, very near of my own vision for a "perfect" Linux OS. We have the big advantage that everything yet still not done. And we count with tools (delta-rpms, metapackages) to build a core system with "add-ons" (like server packages, desktop packages...) improving modularity and system organization.</div> +<div><br></div><div>At the same time, i'm aware that it can be a too big break from the mageia's origins (in the meaning of system's scheme and organization). So, if we can progressively drive mageia to this new scheme sounds reasonable too.</div> +<div><br></div><div>Cheers.</div></div> diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/824696d2/attachment.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/824696d2/attachment.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..94ae8614e --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/824696d2/attachment.html @@ -0,0 +1,9 @@ +<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">2010/9/26 Sascha Schneider <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:schneider@zawm.be">schneider@zawm.be</a>></span><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;"> +I totally agree to that and I hope Mageia will make this happen.<br><br>But I also agree that at this time Mageia has to saddle as a fork, structures have to be build, etc.<br> +<br>Plus, we wouldn't use Mandriva if we don't like the way it works. So no need to change to deb or make Gnome the primer Desktop Env. or stuff like that <br><br>My dream would be a very User and Admin friendly Disto<br> + +<br>One Installer CD for Desktop Dualarch - metapacks for the desktop env <br>One Installer CD for a Serverversion inkl. LXDE + MMC-base and metapaks for some spezial apps inkl. the MMC modules (and pulse)<br>One Installer CD for a Virtualserver using f.e. OpenVZ and a MMC based webui and some community templates<br> + +<br>In my opinion with this simple trippelisation you can arrange all kind of home, business, school, multimedia, netbook ... structures you ever imagine all with one Distro.<br></blockquote><div><br></div><div>That's very, very near of my own vision for a "perfect" Linux OS. We have the big advantage that everything yet still not done. And we count with tools (delta-rpms, metapackages) to build a core system with "add-ons" (like server packages, desktop packages...) improving modularity and system organization.</div> +<div><br></div><div>At the same time, i'm aware that it can be a too big break from the mageia's origins (in the meaning of system's scheme and organization). So, if we can progressively drive mageia to this new scheme sounds reasonable too.</div> +<div><br></div><div>Cheers.</div></div> diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/864e3bb9/attachment-0001.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/864e3bb9/attachment-0001.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..213972e9e --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/864e3bb9/attachment-0001.html @@ -0,0 +1,32 @@ +<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN"> +<html> +<head> + <meta content="text/html; charset=UTF-8" http-equiv="Content-Type"> + <title></title> +</head> +<body text="#000066" bgcolor="#33ccff"> +Le 25/09/2010 15:55, Farfouille a écrit : +<blockquote cite="mid:4C9DFF34.9040100@free.fr" type="cite"> + <meta content="text/html; charset=UTF-8" http-equiv="Content-Type"> +Le 25/09/2010 14:49, Cassian Braconnnier a écrit : + <blockquote cite="mid:4C9DEFC0.40107@free.fr" type="cite"> + <meta content="text/html; charset=UTF-8" http-equiv="Content-Type"> +To say that Java is "higher level" than C++ is absolutely meaningless.<br> + </blockquote> + <blockquote cite="mid:4C9DEFC0.40107@free.fr" type="cite"> <br> +C++ is on a par with Java as far as "level" is concerned.<br> + </blockquote> + <br> +Sorry to contradict you but no there are not, C++ has direct pointer +manipulation, no garbage collector, no introspection and no annotation.<br> + <br> +Sorry also for the ML, because this turn to be a technical discussion.<br> +</blockquote> +I am afraid I don't agree. Please read this thread (in French) on the +subject : +<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.developpez.net/forums/d979620/c-cpp/cpp/langage/t-sens-dire-java-langage-plus-niveau-cpp/">http://www.developpez.net/forums/d979620/c-cpp/cpp/langage/t-sens-dire-java-langage-plus-niveau-cpp/</a><br> +However I agree this is too much of a technical issue to be discussed +on the list.<br> +Cheers.<br> +</body> +</html> diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/864e3bb9/attachment.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/864e3bb9/attachment.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..213972e9e --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/864e3bb9/attachment.html @@ -0,0 +1,32 @@ +<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN"> +<html> +<head> + <meta content="text/html; charset=UTF-8" http-equiv="Content-Type"> + <title></title> +</head> +<body text="#000066" bgcolor="#33ccff"> +Le 25/09/2010 15:55, Farfouille a écrit : +<blockquote cite="mid:4C9DFF34.9040100@free.fr" type="cite"> + <meta content="text/html; charset=UTF-8" http-equiv="Content-Type"> +Le 25/09/2010 14:49, Cassian Braconnnier a écrit : + <blockquote cite="mid:4C9DEFC0.40107@free.fr" type="cite"> + <meta content="text/html; charset=UTF-8" http-equiv="Content-Type"> +To say that Java is "higher level" than C++ is absolutely meaningless.<br> + </blockquote> + <blockquote cite="mid:4C9DEFC0.40107@free.fr" type="cite"> <br> +C++ is on a par with Java as far as "level" is concerned.<br> + </blockquote> + <br> +Sorry to contradict you but no there are not, C++ has direct pointer +manipulation, no garbage collector, no introspection and no annotation.<br> + <br> +Sorry also for the ML, because this turn to be a technical discussion.<br> +</blockquote> +I am afraid I don't agree. Please read this thread (in French) on the +subject : +<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.developpez.net/forums/d979620/c-cpp/cpp/langage/t-sens-dire-java-langage-plus-niveau-cpp/">http://www.developpez.net/forums/d979620/c-cpp/cpp/langage/t-sens-dire-java-langage-plus-niveau-cpp/</a><br> +However I agree this is too much of a technical issue to be discussed +on the list.<br> +Cheers.<br> +</body> +</html> diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/9c739ed5/attachment-0001.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/9c739ed5/attachment-0001.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..5c07f8f6b --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/9c739ed5/attachment-0001.html @@ -0,0 +1,28 @@ +<html><head><style type="text/css"><!-- DIV {margin:0px;} --></style></head><body><div style="font-family:times new roman,new york,times,serif;font-size:12pt"><div>Pour moi cette idée est tous sauf débile, d'ailleurs j'avais fait la même reflexion il y a 2 ans dans les ideas mandriva.<br><br>Le principe existe dans un sens (rpm ---> deb) par le truchement de "alien" pourquoi ne pas le faire dans l'autre sens et allez plus loin en intégrant nativement le procédé à la distro.<br><br>Je ne crois qu'un utilisateur néophite ce pose la question de savoir si il doit utiliser un paquet rpm ou deb ou truc venu de l'espace.....<br><br>PS : J'ai d'ailleurs fais la même reflexion vis à vis de wine qui pour moi devrait être fondu dans la distro pour prendre en charge les .exe car une fois de plus l'utilisateur lambda (comme beaucoup des profs et élèves que je cotoie) se fiche du nom du sytème. Ils veulent que se soit beau et que sa fonctionne sans + avoir a y passer des heures en documentation et essai. PEUT ON LEUR EN VOULOIR ???<br><br>Donc pour moi +1 :-)<br></div><div style="font-family: times new roman,new york,times,serif; font-size: 12pt;"><br><div style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif; font-size: 13px;"><font face="Tahoma" size="2"><hr size="1"><b><span style="font-weight: bold;">De :</span></b> "mageia-discuss-request@mageia.org" <mageia-discuss-request@mageia.org><br><b><span style="font-weight: bold;">À :</span></b> mageia-discuss@mageia.org<br><b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Envoyé le :</span></b> Lun 27 septembre 2010, 3h 15min 31s<br><b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Objet :</span></b> Mageia-discuss Digest, Vol 1, Issue 191<br></font><br>Send Mageia-discuss mailing list submissions to<br> <a ymailto="mailto:mageia-discuss@mageia.org" href="mailto:mageia-discuss@mageia.org">mageia-discuss@mageia.org</a><br><br>To subscribe or + unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit<br> <a href="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-discuss" target="_blank">https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-discuss</a><br>or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to<br> <a ymailto="mailto:mageia-discuss-request@mageia.org" href="mailto:mageia-discuss-request@mageia.org">mageia-discuss-request@mageia.org</a><br><br>You can reach the person managing the list at<br> <a ymailto="mailto:mageia-discuss-owner@mageia.org" href="mailto:mageia-discuss-owner@mageia.org">mageia-discuss-owner@mageia.org</a><br><br>When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific<br>than "Re: Contents of Mageia-discuss digest..."<br><br><br>Today's Topics:<br><br> 1. Re: rpm or deb? (Lucien-Henry Horvath)<br> 2. Re: Mageia's strategy (Frank Griffin)<br> 3. Re: Mageia's strategy (vfmBOFH)<br> 4. Mageia + with Synaptic (paulo ricardo)<br> 5. Re: rpm or deb? (Tux99)<br> 6. Re: Mageia with Synaptic (Tux99)<br> 7. Mageia Developer Version/Edition? (Ireneusz Gierlach)<br><br><br>----------------------------------------------------------------------<br><br>Message: 1<br>Date: Mon, 27 Sep 2010 00:40:44 +0200<br>From: Lucien-Henry Horvath <<a ymailto="mailto:tempo2@marneau.eu" href="mailto:tempo2@marneau.eu">tempo2@marneau.eu</a>><br>To: <a ymailto="mailto:mageia-discuss@mageia.org" href="mailto:mageia-discuss@mageia.org">mageia-discuss@mageia.org</a><br>Subject: Re: [Mageia-discuss] rpm or deb?<br>Message-ID: <<a ymailto="mailto:4C9FCBEC.106@marneau.eu" href="mailto:4C9FCBEC.106@marneau.eu">4C9FCBEC.106@marneau.eu</a>><br>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed<br><br>Hi, (en FR en-dessous)<br>My suggestion is a little crazy ...<br>With the new departure of this distro, perhaps is it a good idea to + <br>invent a sort of "unified managment" of DEV / RPM.<br>We start on urpmi, and add to urpmi the abilities to encapsulate apt-get ?<br>So just easy play " urpmi <a href="http://www.skype.com/download/skype.deb" target="_blank">http://www.skype.com/download/skype.deb</a>" ;-) <br>It's auto-manage dependencies and finaly, urpmi launch "apt-get install".<br>Is it technicaly possible ?<br>--<br>Bonjour (in EN up)<br>Ma suggestion suivante va para?tre d?bile, mais ...<br>En cr?ant une nouvelle distribution, ce serait peut-?tre une bonne id?e <br>d'inventer _enfin_ une sorte de "gestion unifi?e" des paquetages deb et rpm.<br>L'id?e est d'encapsuler apt-get dans urpmi.<br>Ainsi, on lance juste urpmi "URL/t?l?chargement/fichier.deb" et ?a g?re <br>tout seul les d?pendances.<br>Est-ce techniquement possible ?<br><br><br><br>Le 26/09/2010 23:55, Carlos Daniel Ruvalcaba Valenzuela a ?crit :<br>> I personally found no practical advantage of using apt-get vs + urpmi,<br>> while apt has many nice features urpmi is also solid and works<br>> perfectly in most common cases, the only problem you may have is with<br>> malformed packages or with erroneous dependency information, in which<br>> case the only advantage of apt-get is the fact that Debian takes a lot<br>> of care of having correct and working packages, which most RPM based<br>> distros does too (you may get problems with 3th party repos but that<br>> is another problem).<br>><br>> Being a Mandriva fork we would logically stick with it's tools and<br>> packaging system.<br>><br>> Regards,<br>> Carlos Daniel Ruvalcaba Valenzuela<br>><br>> On Sun, Sep 26, 2010 at 2:46 PM, Kristoffer Grundstr?m<br>> <<a ymailto="mailto:kristoffer.grundstrom1983@gmail.com" href="mailto:kristoffer.grundstrom1983@gmail.com">kristoffer.grundstrom1983@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br>> <br>>> Why not create + a new format with the best of both worlds (if possible)?<br>>><br>>> .mageia ?<br>>><br>>> Hoyt Duff skrev 2010-09-26 19:44:<br>>><br>>> On Thu, Sep 23, 2010 at 7:13 AM, RAVI KUMAR BALASUBRAMANIAM<br>>> <<a ymailto="mailto:ravikumar17jan@gmail.com" href="mailto:ravikumar17jan@gmail.com">ravikumar17jan@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br>>><br>>> only thing i hate about mandriva is its rpm based packages<br>>> i prefer apt and deb personally<br>>><br>>> I can understand a personal preference, but why do you believe that<br>>> deb is superior to rpm? Given that Mandriva is already rpm-based, what<br>>> benefit could be derived from abandoning the existing build system and<br>>> urpmi?<br>>><br>>> > From everything I have read, neither system has a clear advantage over<br>>> the other, and the end result of using either is essentially the + same.<br>>> I don't believe that changing to a deb-based system would provide any<br>>> significant benefit to justify the expense in terms of re-training<br>>> devs and creating a new build system.<br>>><br>>><br>>> <br>> <br><br><br><br>------------------------------<br><br>Message: 2<br>Date: Sun, 26 Sep 2010 19:01:59 -0400<br>From: Frank Griffin <<a ymailto="mailto:ftg@roadrunner.com" href="mailto:ftg@roadrunner.com">ftg@roadrunner.com</a>><br>To: Mageia general discussions <<a ymailto="mailto:mageia-discuss@mageia.org" href="mailto:mageia-discuss@mageia.org">mageia-discuss@mageia.org</a>><br>Subject: Re: [Mageia-discuss] Mageia's strategy<br>Message-ID: <<a ymailto="mailto:4C9FD0E7.8090001@roadrunner.com" href="mailto:4C9FD0E7.8090001@roadrunner.com">4C9FD0E7.8090001@roadrunner.com</a>><br>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8<br><br>P. Christeas + wrote:<br>> Let me rant in a rather non-polite tone:<br>> why does *every* Linux distro have to be for Windows users?? Why does every <br>> product need to be targeted at stupid people? (obvious answer: there is lots <br>> of them)<br>><br>> <br>I think you have to separate "looking like Windows" from "implementing<br>as does Microsoft". One of the things MS does very well is user<br>interface design. What they *don't* do so well is implementation:<br>everything is done through the GUI, and MS oversimplifies by making<br>choices silently for the user without giving the user the option to<br>override.<br><br>We're not exactly innocent in this respect either. MDV tools are<br>excellent, but they need the closure of a full transparent CLI as well<br>as a GUI. Experts and administrators need to be able to provide<br>configuration through batch scripts. This is not the case in many<br>areas. I do a + large number of fresh installs intended to create a new<br>system configured as an existing system was, and it's really annoying to<br>boot for the first time and then have to invoke several GUIs to do<br>things like printer configuration, wireless configuration, and font<br>installation.<br><br>In many areas, we have lost track of the simple fact that a Graphical<br>User Interface should be just that - an *interface* to a modular and<br>independent non-graphical module which provides "business logic". It<br>should never be the only way to access the business logic. Hopefully,<br>free of Mandriva's corporate restrictions, we can achieve that now.<br><br>Another issue is choice. System tools have to provide a range of choice<br>suitable for both experts and newbies. While it is acceptable to choose<br>defaults that will work for newbies out of the box, it is not acceptable<br>to limit choices for everyone to those defaults. + We've done this on<br>more than one occasion, the most memorable one being to radically change<br>and lock down the application menu system and refuse to consider any<br>configuration options that would deviate from this.<br><br>Finally, there is transparency. MDV tools have in many cases extended<br>the standard Linux way of doing things in imaginative and useful ways. <br>What they don't do is document those ways so that admins and users used<br>to standard Linux ways can manually intervene or provide tool<br>extensions without extensive code reading. Also, there are many<br>portions of the toolset, e.g. disk partitioning, network sharing,<br>setting up VPNs, etc., which involve extremely intrusive and possibly<br>destructive operations. All such tools need to have an option, not<br>necessarily the default, to display to the user a detailed list of<br>changes that the tool proposes to make, and prompt for approval. <br><br>The + problem here is that advanced users and admins get understandably<br>scared when a tool proposes to do something that involves modifying<br>multiple critical configuration files or system resources without<br>providing the details of the changes so that they can be denied if<br>unwanted, or undone later if so desired.<br><br>An even better approach would be to have each configuration tool produce<br>a program-readable file describing actions it takes, much as RPMs<br>provide, so that the tool, or some general tool running on another<br>bootable system with access to the root partition of the affected system<br>could undo the changes.<br><br>I understand why these things were never done in the past. <br>Management/marketing (and perhaps even some devs) wanted the<br>windows-like newbie simplification, and didn't have the resources or the<br>desire to provide the closure of these features. I hope that we can<br>move past + this.<br><br><br>------------------------------<br><br>Message: 3<br>Date: Mon, 27 Sep 2010 01:02:35 +0200<br>From: vfmBOFH <<a ymailto="mailto:vfmbofh@gmail.com" href="mailto:vfmbofh@gmail.com">vfmbofh@gmail.com</a>><br>To: Mageia general discussions <<a ymailto="mailto:mageia-discuss@mageia.org" href="mailto:mageia-discuss@mageia.org">mageia-discuss@mageia.org</a>><br>Subject: Re: [Mageia-discuss] Mageia's strategy<br>Message-ID:<br> <AANLkTimGPtHi0ZUsVAbdYdTC5+<a ymailto="mailto:F15BXqAasV_tmyTVsp@mail.gmail.com" href="mailto:F15BXqAasV_tmyTVsp@mail.gmail.com">F15BXqAasV_tmyTVsp@mail.gmail.com</a>><br>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"<br><br>2010/9/26 Sascha Schneider <<a ymailto="mailto:schneider@zawm.be" href="mailto:schneider@zawm.be">schneider@zawm.be</a>><br>><br>> I totally agree to that and I hope Mageia will make this happen.<br>><br>> But I also agree that at this time Mageia has + to saddle as a fork,<br>> structures have to be build, etc.<br>><br>> Plus, we wouldn't use Mandriva if we don't like the way it works. So no<br>> need to change to deb or make Gnome the primer Desktop Env. or stuff like<br>> that<br>><br>> My dream would be a very User and Admin friendly Disto<br>><br>> One Installer CD for Desktop Dualarch - metapacks for the desktop env<br>> One Installer CD for a Serverversion inkl. LXDE + MMC-base and metapaks for<br>> some spezial apps inkl. the MMC modules (and pulse)<br>> One Installer CD for a Virtualserver using f.e. OpenVZ and a MMC based<br>> webui and some community templates<br>><br>> In my opinion with this simple trippelisation you can arrange all kind of<br>> home, business, school, multimedia, netbook ... structures you ever imagine<br>> all with one Distro.<br>><br><br>That's very, very near of my own vision for a "perfect" Linux OS. We have<br>the + big advantage that everything yet still not done. And we count with<br>tools (delta-rpms, metapackages) to build a core system with "add-ons" (like<br>server packages, desktop packages...) improving modularity and system<br>organization.<br><br>At the same time, i'm aware that it can be a too big break from the mageia's<br>origins (in the meaning of system's scheme and organization). So, if we can<br>progressively drive mageia to this new scheme sounds reasonable too.<br><br>Cheers.<br>-------------- next part --------------<br>An HTML attachment was scrubbed...<br>URL: </pipermail/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/824696d2/attachment-0001.html><br><br>------------------------------<br><br>Message: 4<br>Date: Mon, 27 Sep 2010 03:01:29 +0300<br>From: paulo ricardo <<a ymailto="mailto:paulo_ricardogo@hotmail.com" href="mailto:paulo_ricardogo@hotmail.com">paulo_ricardogo@hotmail.com</a>><br>To: <<a + ymailto="mailto:mageia-discuss@mageia.org" href="mailto:mageia-discuss@mageia.org">mageia-discuss@mageia.org</a>><br>Subject: [Mageia-discuss] Mageia with Synaptic<br>Message-ID: <<a ymailto="mailto:SNT124-W3FBA1BA8C0245C166EC709F650@phx.gbl" href="mailto:SNT124-W3FBA1BA8C0245C166EC709F650@phx.gbl">SNT124-W3FBA1BA8C0245C166EC709F650@phx.gbl</a>><br>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"<br><br><br>I am not proposing to replace the "URPMI" by the "APT-RPM! I'm proposing we change the "Rpmdrake" with "Synaptic" and keeping the "URPMI!<br>The URPMI is very good, plus the "Rpmdrake" is horrible!<br><br>We discuss these things before the programming work to eat. We must define how the O.S should be! this discussion is important because the GUI package management directly influences the daily work in an OS!<br><br>My proposal is that we keep the rpm and urpmi! But substitute Rpmdrake by Synaptic, and creating a second interface aimed at users + with less knowledge. <br>-------------- next part --------------<br>An HTML attachment was scrubbed...<br>URL: </pipermail/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/c7111483/attachment-0001.html><br><br>------------------------------<br><br>Message: 5<br>Date: Mon, 27 Sep 2010 02:19:57 +0200 (CEST)<br>From: Tux99 <<a ymailto="mailto:tux99-mga@uridium.org" href="mailto:tux99-mga@uridium.org">tux99-mga@uridium.org</a>><br>To: Mageia general discussions <<a ymailto="mailto:mageia-discuss@mageia.org" href="mailto:mageia-discuss@mageia.org">mageia-discuss@mageia.org</a>><br>Subject: Re: [Mageia-discuss] rpm or deb?<br>Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.44.1009270212430.9293-100000@outpost-priv><br>Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII<br><br>On Sun, 26 Sep 2010, Carlos Daniel Ruvalcaba Valenzuela wrote:<br><br>> Being a Mandriva fork + we would logically stick with it's tools and<br>> packaging system.<br><br>Agreed, if we start questioning everything we might as well all go home.<br><br>Mandriva/Mageia are rpm distros and I would expect them to stay like <br>that otherwise we could just all use Debian or one of it's derivatives.<br><br>urpmi is at least as good as apt-get, if anyone finds that urpmi lacks a <br>feature that apt-get has, then please suggest it (not now, later when <br>Mageia is set up) so it can be considered to add that feature to urpmi, <br>but that's definitely not a reason to abandon urpmi.<br><br><br><br>------------------------------<br><br>Message: 6<br>Date: Mon, 27 Sep 2010 02:56:24 +0200 (CEST)<br>From: Tux99 <<a ymailto="mailto:tux99-mga@uridium.org" href="mailto:tux99-mga@uridium.org">tux99-mga@uridium.org</a>><br>To: Mageia general discussions <<a ymailto="mailto:mageia-discuss@mageia.org" + href="mailto:mageia-discuss@mageia.org">mageia-discuss@mageia.org</a>><br>Subject: Re: [Mageia-discuss] Mageia with Synaptic<br>Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.44.1009270248310.9293-100000@outpost-priv><br>Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII<br><br>On Mon, 27 Sep 2010, paulo ricardo wrote:<br><br>> <br>> I am not proposing to replace the "URPMI" by the "APT-RPM! I'm<br>> proposing we change the "Rpmdrake" with "Synaptic" and keeping the<br>> "URPMI! The URPMI is very good, plus the "Rpmdrake" is horrible!<br><br>Instead of saying "rpmdrake is horrible", it would be more useful if you <br>list what you don't like so it can be improved. No tool is perfect, I'm <br>sure Synaptic has flaws to, so just switching to Synaptic only means <br>trading one set of flaws for another.<br><br>Personally I find rpmdrake works perfectly fine (the startup speed <br>could need improving though), it does all I need it to do (and I would <br>consider + myself an advanced user, since I have 15 years Linux experience <br>and work as a sysadmin) and then there are always the urpmi CLI tools as <br>alternative.<br><br>So lets stop wasting time by talking badly about all those things that <br>make Mandriva (and therefore Mageia) the great distro it is, and instead <br>lets concentrate on improving (rather than replacing) the tools of <br>Madriva/Mageia.<br><br><br><br>------------------------------<br><br>Message: 7<br>Date: Sun, 26 Sep 2010 21:17:21 -0400<br>From: Ireneusz Gierlach <<a ymailto="mailto:irek.gierlach@gmail.com" href="mailto:irek.gierlach@gmail.com">irek.gierlach@gmail.com</a>><br>To: Mageia general discussions <<a ymailto="mailto:mageia-discuss@mageia.org" href="mailto:mageia-discuss@mageia.org">mageia-discuss@mageia.org</a>><br>Subject: [Mageia-discuss] Mageia Developer Version/Edition?<br>Message-ID: <<a ymailto="mailto:4C9FF0A1.6070704@gmail.com" + href="mailto:4C9FF0A1.6070704@gmail.com">4C9FF0A1.6070704@gmail.com</a>><br>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed<br><br> I just thought of this, and I have never seen that done, so I'm not <br>sure how it would (if) work exactly.<br>I was thinking about creating a specific version of the OS that would <br>consist of all development tools required to build packages, develop <br>components, etc. This would provide the same environment for all <br>developers, and help in bug fixing, as they would all have the same <br>packages (by default, I was also thinking about implementing a better <br>version of Mandriva's Package Stats with an ability to input a list of <br>packages [from the bug reporter] so the tester can automatically <br>download the same versions). It is just a thought, but I would love to <br>see something like this implemented. I want to see what you guys think <br>of this too ;) (I'm trying to create something + like this but not for OS <br>but for a framework, so I want to see some opinions.)<br><br><br>------------------------------<br><br>_______________________________________________<br>Mageia-discuss mailing list<br><a ymailto="mailto:Mageia-discuss@mageia.org" href="mailto:Mageia-discuss@mageia.org">Mageia-discuss@mageia.org</a><br><a href="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-discuss" target="_blank">https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-discuss</a><br><br>End of Mageia-discuss Digest, Vol 1, Issue 191<br>**********************************************<br></div></div> +</div><br> + + + + + </body></html>
\ No newline at end of file diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/9c739ed5/attachment.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/9c739ed5/attachment.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..5c07f8f6b --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/9c739ed5/attachment.html @@ -0,0 +1,28 @@ +<html><head><style type="text/css"><!-- DIV {margin:0px;} --></style></head><body><div style="font-family:times new roman,new york,times,serif;font-size:12pt"><div>Pour moi cette idée est tous sauf débile, d'ailleurs j'avais fait la même reflexion il y a 2 ans dans les ideas mandriva.<br><br>Le principe existe dans un sens (rpm ---> deb) par le truchement de "alien" pourquoi ne pas le faire dans l'autre sens et allez plus loin en intégrant nativement le procédé à la distro.<br><br>Je ne crois qu'un utilisateur néophite ce pose la question de savoir si il doit utiliser un paquet rpm ou deb ou truc venu de l'espace.....<br><br>PS : J'ai d'ailleurs fais la même reflexion vis à vis de wine qui pour moi devrait être fondu dans la distro pour prendre en charge les .exe car une fois de plus l'utilisateur lambda (comme beaucoup des profs et élèves que je cotoie) se fiche du nom du sytème. Ils veulent que se soit beau et que sa fonctionne sans + avoir a y passer des heures en documentation et essai. PEUT ON LEUR EN VOULOIR ???<br><br>Donc pour moi +1 :-)<br></div><div style="font-family: times new roman,new york,times,serif; font-size: 12pt;"><br><div style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif; font-size: 13px;"><font face="Tahoma" size="2"><hr size="1"><b><span style="font-weight: bold;">De :</span></b> "mageia-discuss-request@mageia.org" <mageia-discuss-request@mageia.org><br><b><span style="font-weight: bold;">À :</span></b> mageia-discuss@mageia.org<br><b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Envoyé le :</span></b> Lun 27 septembre 2010, 3h 15min 31s<br><b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Objet :</span></b> Mageia-discuss Digest, Vol 1, Issue 191<br></font><br>Send Mageia-discuss mailing list submissions to<br> <a ymailto="mailto:mageia-discuss@mageia.org" href="mailto:mageia-discuss@mageia.org">mageia-discuss@mageia.org</a><br><br>To subscribe or + unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit<br> <a href="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-discuss" target="_blank">https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-discuss</a><br>or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to<br> <a ymailto="mailto:mageia-discuss-request@mageia.org" href="mailto:mageia-discuss-request@mageia.org">mageia-discuss-request@mageia.org</a><br><br>You can reach the person managing the list at<br> <a ymailto="mailto:mageia-discuss-owner@mageia.org" href="mailto:mageia-discuss-owner@mageia.org">mageia-discuss-owner@mageia.org</a><br><br>When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific<br>than "Re: Contents of Mageia-discuss digest..."<br><br><br>Today's Topics:<br><br> 1. Re: rpm or deb? (Lucien-Henry Horvath)<br> 2. Re: Mageia's strategy (Frank Griffin)<br> 3. Re: Mageia's strategy (vfmBOFH)<br> 4. Mageia + with Synaptic (paulo ricardo)<br> 5. Re: rpm or deb? (Tux99)<br> 6. Re: Mageia with Synaptic (Tux99)<br> 7. Mageia Developer Version/Edition? (Ireneusz Gierlach)<br><br><br>----------------------------------------------------------------------<br><br>Message: 1<br>Date: Mon, 27 Sep 2010 00:40:44 +0200<br>From: Lucien-Henry Horvath <<a ymailto="mailto:tempo2@marneau.eu" href="mailto:tempo2@marneau.eu">tempo2@marneau.eu</a>><br>To: <a ymailto="mailto:mageia-discuss@mageia.org" href="mailto:mageia-discuss@mageia.org">mageia-discuss@mageia.org</a><br>Subject: Re: [Mageia-discuss] rpm or deb?<br>Message-ID: <<a ymailto="mailto:4C9FCBEC.106@marneau.eu" href="mailto:4C9FCBEC.106@marneau.eu">4C9FCBEC.106@marneau.eu</a>><br>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed<br><br>Hi, (en FR en-dessous)<br>My suggestion is a little crazy ...<br>With the new departure of this distro, perhaps is it a good idea to + <br>invent a sort of "unified managment" of DEV / RPM.<br>We start on urpmi, and add to urpmi the abilities to encapsulate apt-get ?<br>So just easy play " urpmi <a href="http://www.skype.com/download/skype.deb" target="_blank">http://www.skype.com/download/skype.deb</a>" ;-) <br>It's auto-manage dependencies and finaly, urpmi launch "apt-get install".<br>Is it technicaly possible ?<br>--<br>Bonjour (in EN up)<br>Ma suggestion suivante va para?tre d?bile, mais ...<br>En cr?ant une nouvelle distribution, ce serait peut-?tre une bonne id?e <br>d'inventer _enfin_ une sorte de "gestion unifi?e" des paquetages deb et rpm.<br>L'id?e est d'encapsuler apt-get dans urpmi.<br>Ainsi, on lance juste urpmi "URL/t?l?chargement/fichier.deb" et ?a g?re <br>tout seul les d?pendances.<br>Est-ce techniquement possible ?<br><br><br><br>Le 26/09/2010 23:55, Carlos Daniel Ruvalcaba Valenzuela a ?crit :<br>> I personally found no practical advantage of using apt-get vs + urpmi,<br>> while apt has many nice features urpmi is also solid and works<br>> perfectly in most common cases, the only problem you may have is with<br>> malformed packages or with erroneous dependency information, in which<br>> case the only advantage of apt-get is the fact that Debian takes a lot<br>> of care of having correct and working packages, which most RPM based<br>> distros does too (you may get problems with 3th party repos but that<br>> is another problem).<br>><br>> Being a Mandriva fork we would logically stick with it's tools and<br>> packaging system.<br>><br>> Regards,<br>> Carlos Daniel Ruvalcaba Valenzuela<br>><br>> On Sun, Sep 26, 2010 at 2:46 PM, Kristoffer Grundstr?m<br>> <<a ymailto="mailto:kristoffer.grundstrom1983@gmail.com" href="mailto:kristoffer.grundstrom1983@gmail.com">kristoffer.grundstrom1983@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br>> <br>>> Why not create + a new format with the best of both worlds (if possible)?<br>>><br>>> .mageia ?<br>>><br>>> Hoyt Duff skrev 2010-09-26 19:44:<br>>><br>>> On Thu, Sep 23, 2010 at 7:13 AM, RAVI KUMAR BALASUBRAMANIAM<br>>> <<a ymailto="mailto:ravikumar17jan@gmail.com" href="mailto:ravikumar17jan@gmail.com">ravikumar17jan@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br>>><br>>> only thing i hate about mandriva is its rpm based packages<br>>> i prefer apt and deb personally<br>>><br>>> I can understand a personal preference, but why do you believe that<br>>> deb is superior to rpm? Given that Mandriva is already rpm-based, what<br>>> benefit could be derived from abandoning the existing build system and<br>>> urpmi?<br>>><br>>> > From everything I have read, neither system has a clear advantage over<br>>> the other, and the end result of using either is essentially the + same.<br>>> I don't believe that changing to a deb-based system would provide any<br>>> significant benefit to justify the expense in terms of re-training<br>>> devs and creating a new build system.<br>>><br>>><br>>> <br>> <br><br><br><br>------------------------------<br><br>Message: 2<br>Date: Sun, 26 Sep 2010 19:01:59 -0400<br>From: Frank Griffin <<a ymailto="mailto:ftg@roadrunner.com" href="mailto:ftg@roadrunner.com">ftg@roadrunner.com</a>><br>To: Mageia general discussions <<a ymailto="mailto:mageia-discuss@mageia.org" href="mailto:mageia-discuss@mageia.org">mageia-discuss@mageia.org</a>><br>Subject: Re: [Mageia-discuss] Mageia's strategy<br>Message-ID: <<a ymailto="mailto:4C9FD0E7.8090001@roadrunner.com" href="mailto:4C9FD0E7.8090001@roadrunner.com">4C9FD0E7.8090001@roadrunner.com</a>><br>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8<br><br>P. Christeas + wrote:<br>> Let me rant in a rather non-polite tone:<br>> why does *every* Linux distro have to be for Windows users?? Why does every <br>> product need to be targeted at stupid people? (obvious answer: there is lots <br>> of them)<br>><br>> <br>I think you have to separate "looking like Windows" from "implementing<br>as does Microsoft". One of the things MS does very well is user<br>interface design. What they *don't* do so well is implementation:<br>everything is done through the GUI, and MS oversimplifies by making<br>choices silently for the user without giving the user the option to<br>override.<br><br>We're not exactly innocent in this respect either. MDV tools are<br>excellent, but they need the closure of a full transparent CLI as well<br>as a GUI. Experts and administrators need to be able to provide<br>configuration through batch scripts. This is not the case in many<br>areas. I do a + large number of fresh installs intended to create a new<br>system configured as an existing system was, and it's really annoying to<br>boot for the first time and then have to invoke several GUIs to do<br>things like printer configuration, wireless configuration, and font<br>installation.<br><br>In many areas, we have lost track of the simple fact that a Graphical<br>User Interface should be just that - an *interface* to a modular and<br>independent non-graphical module which provides "business logic". It<br>should never be the only way to access the business logic. Hopefully,<br>free of Mandriva's corporate restrictions, we can achieve that now.<br><br>Another issue is choice. System tools have to provide a range of choice<br>suitable for both experts and newbies. While it is acceptable to choose<br>defaults that will work for newbies out of the box, it is not acceptable<br>to limit choices for everyone to those defaults. + We've done this on<br>more than one occasion, the most memorable one being to radically change<br>and lock down the application menu system and refuse to consider any<br>configuration options that would deviate from this.<br><br>Finally, there is transparency. MDV tools have in many cases extended<br>the standard Linux way of doing things in imaginative and useful ways. <br>What they don't do is document those ways so that admins and users used<br>to standard Linux ways can manually intervene or provide tool<br>extensions without extensive code reading. Also, there are many<br>portions of the toolset, e.g. disk partitioning, network sharing,<br>setting up VPNs, etc., which involve extremely intrusive and possibly<br>destructive operations. All such tools need to have an option, not<br>necessarily the default, to display to the user a detailed list of<br>changes that the tool proposes to make, and prompt for approval. <br><br>The + problem here is that advanced users and admins get understandably<br>scared when a tool proposes to do something that involves modifying<br>multiple critical configuration files or system resources without<br>providing the details of the changes so that they can be denied if<br>unwanted, or undone later if so desired.<br><br>An even better approach would be to have each configuration tool produce<br>a program-readable file describing actions it takes, much as RPMs<br>provide, so that the tool, or some general tool running on another<br>bootable system with access to the root partition of the affected system<br>could undo the changes.<br><br>I understand why these things were never done in the past. <br>Management/marketing (and perhaps even some devs) wanted the<br>windows-like newbie simplification, and didn't have the resources or the<br>desire to provide the closure of these features. I hope that we can<br>move past + this.<br><br><br>------------------------------<br><br>Message: 3<br>Date: Mon, 27 Sep 2010 01:02:35 +0200<br>From: vfmBOFH <<a ymailto="mailto:vfmbofh@gmail.com" href="mailto:vfmbofh@gmail.com">vfmbofh@gmail.com</a>><br>To: Mageia general discussions <<a ymailto="mailto:mageia-discuss@mageia.org" href="mailto:mageia-discuss@mageia.org">mageia-discuss@mageia.org</a>><br>Subject: Re: [Mageia-discuss] Mageia's strategy<br>Message-ID:<br> <AANLkTimGPtHi0ZUsVAbdYdTC5+<a ymailto="mailto:F15BXqAasV_tmyTVsp@mail.gmail.com" href="mailto:F15BXqAasV_tmyTVsp@mail.gmail.com">F15BXqAasV_tmyTVsp@mail.gmail.com</a>><br>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"<br><br>2010/9/26 Sascha Schneider <<a ymailto="mailto:schneider@zawm.be" href="mailto:schneider@zawm.be">schneider@zawm.be</a>><br>><br>> I totally agree to that and I hope Mageia will make this happen.<br>><br>> But I also agree that at this time Mageia has + to saddle as a fork,<br>> structures have to be build, etc.<br>><br>> Plus, we wouldn't use Mandriva if we don't like the way it works. So no<br>> need to change to deb or make Gnome the primer Desktop Env. or stuff like<br>> that<br>><br>> My dream would be a very User and Admin friendly Disto<br>><br>> One Installer CD for Desktop Dualarch - metapacks for the desktop env<br>> One Installer CD for a Serverversion inkl. LXDE + MMC-base and metapaks for<br>> some spezial apps inkl. the MMC modules (and pulse)<br>> One Installer CD for a Virtualserver using f.e. OpenVZ and a MMC based<br>> webui and some community templates<br>><br>> In my opinion with this simple trippelisation you can arrange all kind of<br>> home, business, school, multimedia, netbook ... structures you ever imagine<br>> all with one Distro.<br>><br><br>That's very, very near of my own vision for a "perfect" Linux OS. We have<br>the + big advantage that everything yet still not done. And we count with<br>tools (delta-rpms, metapackages) to build a core system with "add-ons" (like<br>server packages, desktop packages...) improving modularity and system<br>organization.<br><br>At the same time, i'm aware that it can be a too big break from the mageia's<br>origins (in the meaning of system's scheme and organization). So, if we can<br>progressively drive mageia to this new scheme sounds reasonable too.<br><br>Cheers.<br>-------------- next part --------------<br>An HTML attachment was scrubbed...<br>URL: </pipermail/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/824696d2/attachment-0001.html><br><br>------------------------------<br><br>Message: 4<br>Date: Mon, 27 Sep 2010 03:01:29 +0300<br>From: paulo ricardo <<a ymailto="mailto:paulo_ricardogo@hotmail.com" href="mailto:paulo_ricardogo@hotmail.com">paulo_ricardogo@hotmail.com</a>><br>To: <<a + ymailto="mailto:mageia-discuss@mageia.org" href="mailto:mageia-discuss@mageia.org">mageia-discuss@mageia.org</a>><br>Subject: [Mageia-discuss] Mageia with Synaptic<br>Message-ID: <<a ymailto="mailto:SNT124-W3FBA1BA8C0245C166EC709F650@phx.gbl" href="mailto:SNT124-W3FBA1BA8C0245C166EC709F650@phx.gbl">SNT124-W3FBA1BA8C0245C166EC709F650@phx.gbl</a>><br>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"<br><br><br>I am not proposing to replace the "URPMI" by the "APT-RPM! I'm proposing we change the "Rpmdrake" with "Synaptic" and keeping the "URPMI!<br>The URPMI is very good, plus the "Rpmdrake" is horrible!<br><br>We discuss these things before the programming work to eat. We must define how the O.S should be! this discussion is important because the GUI package management directly influences the daily work in an OS!<br><br>My proposal is that we keep the rpm and urpmi! But substitute Rpmdrake by Synaptic, and creating a second interface aimed at users + with less knowledge. <br>-------------- next part --------------<br>An HTML attachment was scrubbed...<br>URL: </pipermail/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/c7111483/attachment-0001.html><br><br>------------------------------<br><br>Message: 5<br>Date: Mon, 27 Sep 2010 02:19:57 +0200 (CEST)<br>From: Tux99 <<a ymailto="mailto:tux99-mga@uridium.org" href="mailto:tux99-mga@uridium.org">tux99-mga@uridium.org</a>><br>To: Mageia general discussions <<a ymailto="mailto:mageia-discuss@mageia.org" href="mailto:mageia-discuss@mageia.org">mageia-discuss@mageia.org</a>><br>Subject: Re: [Mageia-discuss] rpm or deb?<br>Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.44.1009270212430.9293-100000@outpost-priv><br>Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII<br><br>On Sun, 26 Sep 2010, Carlos Daniel Ruvalcaba Valenzuela wrote:<br><br>> Being a Mandriva fork + we would logically stick with it's tools and<br>> packaging system.<br><br>Agreed, if we start questioning everything we might as well all go home.<br><br>Mandriva/Mageia are rpm distros and I would expect them to stay like <br>that otherwise we could just all use Debian or one of it's derivatives.<br><br>urpmi is at least as good as apt-get, if anyone finds that urpmi lacks a <br>feature that apt-get has, then please suggest it (not now, later when <br>Mageia is set up) so it can be considered to add that feature to urpmi, <br>but that's definitely not a reason to abandon urpmi.<br><br><br><br>------------------------------<br><br>Message: 6<br>Date: Mon, 27 Sep 2010 02:56:24 +0200 (CEST)<br>From: Tux99 <<a ymailto="mailto:tux99-mga@uridium.org" href="mailto:tux99-mga@uridium.org">tux99-mga@uridium.org</a>><br>To: Mageia general discussions <<a ymailto="mailto:mageia-discuss@mageia.org" + href="mailto:mageia-discuss@mageia.org">mageia-discuss@mageia.org</a>><br>Subject: Re: [Mageia-discuss] Mageia with Synaptic<br>Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.44.1009270248310.9293-100000@outpost-priv><br>Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII<br><br>On Mon, 27 Sep 2010, paulo ricardo wrote:<br><br>> <br>> I am not proposing to replace the "URPMI" by the "APT-RPM! I'm<br>> proposing we change the "Rpmdrake" with "Synaptic" and keeping the<br>> "URPMI! The URPMI is very good, plus the "Rpmdrake" is horrible!<br><br>Instead of saying "rpmdrake is horrible", it would be more useful if you <br>list what you don't like so it can be improved. No tool is perfect, I'm <br>sure Synaptic has flaws to, so just switching to Synaptic only means <br>trading one set of flaws for another.<br><br>Personally I find rpmdrake works perfectly fine (the startup speed <br>could need improving though), it does all I need it to do (and I would <br>consider + myself an advanced user, since I have 15 years Linux experience <br>and work as a sysadmin) and then there are always the urpmi CLI tools as <br>alternative.<br><br>So lets stop wasting time by talking badly about all those things that <br>make Mandriva (and therefore Mageia) the great distro it is, and instead <br>lets concentrate on improving (rather than replacing) the tools of <br>Madriva/Mageia.<br><br><br><br>------------------------------<br><br>Message: 7<br>Date: Sun, 26 Sep 2010 21:17:21 -0400<br>From: Ireneusz Gierlach <<a ymailto="mailto:irek.gierlach@gmail.com" href="mailto:irek.gierlach@gmail.com">irek.gierlach@gmail.com</a>><br>To: Mageia general discussions <<a ymailto="mailto:mageia-discuss@mageia.org" href="mailto:mageia-discuss@mageia.org">mageia-discuss@mageia.org</a>><br>Subject: [Mageia-discuss] Mageia Developer Version/Edition?<br>Message-ID: <<a ymailto="mailto:4C9FF0A1.6070704@gmail.com" + href="mailto:4C9FF0A1.6070704@gmail.com">4C9FF0A1.6070704@gmail.com</a>><br>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed<br><br> I just thought of this, and I have never seen that done, so I'm not <br>sure how it would (if) work exactly.<br>I was thinking about creating a specific version of the OS that would <br>consist of all development tools required to build packages, develop <br>components, etc. This would provide the same environment for all <br>developers, and help in bug fixing, as they would all have the same <br>packages (by default, I was also thinking about implementing a better <br>version of Mandriva's Package Stats with an ability to input a list of <br>packages [from the bug reporter] so the tester can automatically <br>download the same versions). It is just a thought, but I would love to <br>see something like this implemented. I want to see what you guys think <br>of this too ;) (I'm trying to create something + like this but not for OS <br>but for a framework, so I want to see some opinions.)<br><br><br>------------------------------<br><br>_______________________________________________<br>Mageia-discuss mailing list<br><a ymailto="mailto:Mageia-discuss@mageia.org" href="mailto:Mageia-discuss@mageia.org">Mageia-discuss@mageia.org</a><br><a href="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-discuss" target="_blank">https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-discuss</a><br><br>End of Mageia-discuss Digest, Vol 1, Issue 191<br>**********************************************<br></div></div> +</div><br> + + + + + </body></html>
\ No newline at end of file diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/a4ba292f/attachment-0001.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/a4ba292f/attachment-0001.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..843fc5d2a --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/a4ba292f/attachment-0001.html @@ -0,0 +1,5 @@ +First, why people chose Linux?<br>I think because it is free (of charge in the beginning). There is a learn curve for Windows too, you still need to do lots of tweaks if you really need to use it at full power. Linux too. So I wouldn't talk about the costs in this matter.<br> +Then, it has the source open. Here comes the real freedom. At least I know that somebody will discover if some app will spy on you. You never know what kind of info Windows send to the mother ship and when.<br>Not to talk about the opportunity to adapt the code...<br> +And, not at least, come the things that could not do with Windows.<br>Secondly, why people would chose Mageia?<br>Now, the followers count to see the Mandriva's quality in a better way of communication. I think the Mandriva's distro is the base in all aspects.<br> +<br>After that, it is place to improvement. Who knows, maybe Mageia will have its own life, far from Mandriva's path, but at same quality at least.<br><br>Me, personally, from the usability point of use, I would like it close as it is now in terms of available packages. I would like to have the opportunity to poll for some apps (that was the Mandriva Club members privilege afaik). I would like to have one DVD with all the stuff and an installer to allow me to install a server, a desktop, or to start a "live CD" environment. And a second DVD with the sources. Different choices in different settings, but same packages. I hate the idea of having several CD/DVD flavors (of course, to be available as many users would like that). I would focus on 64 bit (I have 64 bit cpu since the first one appeared on the market, now nobody does 32 bit cpus, even for multimedia, afaik). I would like to have some visual improvement on the desktop and a lighter KDE (but that's KDE team's job). I would like to have the KDE as classy as Gnome, but with KDE's plugability.<br> +<br>What I think it is a must in order to achieve success, as in Ubuntu's case, is a good collection of How to's. Whatever I wanted to do to setup something, tons of how to's for Ubuntu arose first.<br> diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/a4ba292f/attachment.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/a4ba292f/attachment.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..843fc5d2a --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/a4ba292f/attachment.html @@ -0,0 +1,5 @@ +First, why people chose Linux?<br>I think because it is free (of charge in the beginning). There is a learn curve for Windows too, you still need to do lots of tweaks if you really need to use it at full power. Linux too. So I wouldn't talk about the costs in this matter.<br> +Then, it has the source open. Here comes the real freedom. At least I know that somebody will discover if some app will spy on you. You never know what kind of info Windows send to the mother ship and when.<br>Not to talk about the opportunity to adapt the code...<br> +And, not at least, come the things that could not do with Windows.<br>Secondly, why people would chose Mageia?<br>Now, the followers count to see the Mandriva's quality in a better way of communication. I think the Mandriva's distro is the base in all aspects.<br> +<br>After that, it is place to improvement. Who knows, maybe Mageia will have its own life, far from Mandriva's path, but at same quality at least.<br><br>Me, personally, from the usability point of use, I would like it close as it is now in terms of available packages. I would like to have the opportunity to poll for some apps (that was the Mandriva Club members privilege afaik). I would like to have one DVD with all the stuff and an installer to allow me to install a server, a desktop, or to start a "live CD" environment. And a second DVD with the sources. Different choices in different settings, but same packages. I hate the idea of having several CD/DVD flavors (of course, to be available as many users would like that). I would focus on 64 bit (I have 64 bit cpu since the first one appeared on the market, now nobody does 32 bit cpus, even for multimedia, afaik). I would like to have some visual improvement on the desktop and a lighter KDE (but that's KDE team's job). I would like to have the KDE as classy as Gnome, but with KDE's plugability.<br> +<br>What I think it is a must in order to achieve success, as in Ubuntu's case, is a good collection of How to's. Whatever I wanted to do to setup something, tons of how to's for Ubuntu arose first.<br> diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/a50f6add/attachment-0001.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/a50f6add/attachment-0001.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..669ec9bbd --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/a50f6add/attachment-0001.html @@ -0,0 +1,7 @@ +<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">2010/9/23 RAVI KUMAR BALASUBRAMANIAM <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:ravikumar17jan@gmail.com">ravikumar17jan@gmail.com</a>></span><br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;"> +only thing i hate about mandriva is its rpm based packages<br> +i prefer apt and deb personally<br> +</blockquote></div><br><div>Hi all.</div><div><br></div><div>I use several distros, sombe rpm-based, some deb-based.</div><div><br></div><div>IMHO, there's no real difference between both package types. All troubles i've found on rpm packages are exactly the same i've found on .deb ones. And all are for the same reason: The package has some error on their build process (bad dependences, outdated versions of them...)</div> +<div><br></div><div>So, i see no objective reason to change rpm-packaging system. But we must be carefully until paranoia when we're building them. A well-done build rpm package works as smooth and clean than a well-done build .deb one.</div> +<div><br></div><div>If you're looking some other aspects (i.e. performance of the package manager) there's no sensible difference for a normal user between both package types. You can find urpmi slower than apt-get, or viceversa. I've found opposite opinions about this ever among my colleagues. This leads to me that i'ts a subjective (or particular system-dependant) estimation.</div> +<div><br></div><div>Cheers.</div><div><br></div> diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/a50f6add/attachment.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/a50f6add/attachment.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..669ec9bbd --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/a50f6add/attachment.html @@ -0,0 +1,7 @@ +<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">2010/9/23 RAVI KUMAR BALASUBRAMANIAM <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:ravikumar17jan@gmail.com">ravikumar17jan@gmail.com</a>></span><br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;"> +only thing i hate about mandriva is its rpm based packages<br> +i prefer apt and deb personally<br> +</blockquote></div><br><div>Hi all.</div><div><br></div><div>I use several distros, sombe rpm-based, some deb-based.</div><div><br></div><div>IMHO, there's no real difference between both package types. All troubles i've found on rpm packages are exactly the same i've found on .deb ones. And all are for the same reason: The package has some error on their build process (bad dependences, outdated versions of them...)</div> +<div><br></div><div>So, i see no objective reason to change rpm-packaging system. But we must be carefully until paranoia when we're building them. A well-done build rpm package works as smooth and clean than a well-done build .deb one.</div> +<div><br></div><div>If you're looking some other aspects (i.e. performance of the package manager) there's no sensible difference for a normal user between both package types. You can find urpmi slower than apt-get, or viceversa. I've found opposite opinions about this ever among my colleagues. This leads to me that i'ts a subjective (or particular system-dependant) estimation.</div> +<div><br></div><div>Cheers.</div><div><br></div> diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/aa1fe60c/attachment-0001.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/aa1fe60c/attachment-0001.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..a8ab07b0a --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/aa1fe60c/attachment-0001.html @@ -0,0 +1,12 @@ +<br><div class="gmail_quote"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;"> +Stop this discussion that is useless, please.<br> +<div><div></div><div class="h5"><br> +--<br> +Sandro Cazzaniga<br> +Bashburn hacker (<a href="http://bashburn.dose.se/" target="_blank">http://bashburn.dose.se/</a>)<br> +Mageia Contributor (<a href="http://www.mageia.org/fr/" target="_blank">http://www.mageia.org/fr/</a>)<br> +Serial Blogger (<a href="http://twitter.com/Kharec" target="_blank">http://twitter.com/Kharec</a>)<br> +Developer (Perl, Bash, C)<br> +Vice President, secretary and member of CA of Alolise<br> +(<a href="http://www.alolise.org" target="_blank">http://www.alolise.org</a>)<br> +</div></div></blockquote></div><br><br clear="all"><br>Exactly that, spend energy in more important things.<br> diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/aa1fe60c/attachment.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/aa1fe60c/attachment.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..a8ab07b0a --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/aa1fe60c/attachment.html @@ -0,0 +1,12 @@ +<br><div class="gmail_quote"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;"> +Stop this discussion that is useless, please.<br> +<div><div></div><div class="h5"><br> +--<br> +Sandro Cazzaniga<br> +Bashburn hacker (<a href="http://bashburn.dose.se/" target="_blank">http://bashburn.dose.se/</a>)<br> +Mageia Contributor (<a href="http://www.mageia.org/fr/" target="_blank">http://www.mageia.org/fr/</a>)<br> +Serial Blogger (<a href="http://twitter.com/Kharec" target="_blank">http://twitter.com/Kharec</a>)<br> +Developer (Perl, Bash, C)<br> +Vice President, secretary and member of CA of Alolise<br> +(<a href="http://www.alolise.org" target="_blank">http://www.alolise.org</a>)<br> +</div></div></blockquote></div><br><br clear="all"><br>Exactly that, spend energy in more important things.<br> diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/b15e79ce/attachment-0001.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/b15e79ce/attachment-0001.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..db4dcec8c --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/b15e79ce/attachment-0001.html @@ -0,0 +1,40 @@ +<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN"> +<html> +<head> + <meta content="text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1" + http-equiv="Content-Type"> +</head> +<body text="#000000" bgcolor="#ffffff"> +Le 21/09/2010 22:19, Ignacio Salcedo a écrit : +<blockquote cite="mid:4C991344.3020007@ignacio-profile.com" type="cite"> + <meta content="text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1" + http-equiv="Content-Type"> + <span id="result_box" class="long_text"><span style="" title="">I +have proposed this model: <a moz-do-not-send="true" + class="moz-txt-link-freetext" + href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/ignacioprofile/5011912313/in/pool-1491252@N24/">http://www.flickr.com/photos/ignacioprofile/5011912313/in/pool-1491252@N24/</a> +, </span></span><span id="result_box" + class="long_text + short_text"><span + style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); color: rgb(0, 0, 0);" + title="">on the other hand</span></span><span id="result_box" + class="long_text"><span style="" title="">, an idea, always a good +concept.</span></span><br> +</blockquote> +<br> +Hey,<br> +<br> +I have to admit that I really like this one. Shapes are pure, design is +light. By far, the best I ever seen for this project.<br> +<br> +That said, would it be possible to see some variations regarding the +baseline color ?<br> +<br> +The only point I have regarding this logo is the font that looks like +too much medieval from my taste.<br> +<br> +Anyway, great job !<br> +<br> +Erwan,<br> +</body> +</html> diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/b15e79ce/attachment.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/b15e79ce/attachment.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..db4dcec8c --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/b15e79ce/attachment.html @@ -0,0 +1,40 @@ +<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN"> +<html> +<head> + <meta content="text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1" + http-equiv="Content-Type"> +</head> +<body text="#000000" bgcolor="#ffffff"> +Le 21/09/2010 22:19, Ignacio Salcedo a écrit : +<blockquote cite="mid:4C991344.3020007@ignacio-profile.com" type="cite"> + <meta content="text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1" + http-equiv="Content-Type"> + <span id="result_box" class="long_text"><span style="" title="">I +have proposed this model: <a moz-do-not-send="true" + class="moz-txt-link-freetext" + href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/ignacioprofile/5011912313/in/pool-1491252@N24/">http://www.flickr.com/photos/ignacioprofile/5011912313/in/pool-1491252@N24/</a> +, </span></span><span id="result_box" + class="long_text + short_text"><span + style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); color: rgb(0, 0, 0);" + title="">on the other hand</span></span><span id="result_box" + class="long_text"><span style="" title="">, an idea, always a good +concept.</span></span><br> +</blockquote> +<br> +Hey,<br> +<br> +I have to admit that I really like this one. Shapes are pure, design is +light. By far, the best I ever seen for this project.<br> +<br> +That said, would it be possible to see some variations regarding the +baseline color ?<br> +<br> +The only point I have regarding this logo is the font that looks like +too much medieval from my taste.<br> +<br> +Anyway, great job !<br> +<br> +Erwan,<br> +</body> +</html> diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/c1ebc03c/attachment-0001.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/c1ebc03c/attachment-0001.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..af277d3a0 --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/c1ebc03c/attachment-0001.html @@ -0,0 +1,8 @@ +<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">2010/9/27 Dubeau, Patrick <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:Patrick.Dubeau@ccq.org">Patrick.Dubeau@ccq.org</a>></span><br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;"> +[...]<br> +Once we have the permission to use the name Mageia in MLO, we'll rename<br> +everything in our domain and get a new domain name. We'll have some breakage,<br> +but I estimated it'll be of no real consequences and easy to address.<br> +<br> +Pat<br> +</blockquote></div><br><br clear="all">Ok thanks, this is what i wanted to know ( il a du boulot! :) )<br><br>-- <br><div>Dimitrios Glentadakis</div><br> diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/c1ebc03c/attachment.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/c1ebc03c/attachment.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..af277d3a0 --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/c1ebc03c/attachment.html @@ -0,0 +1,8 @@ +<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">2010/9/27 Dubeau, Patrick <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:Patrick.Dubeau@ccq.org">Patrick.Dubeau@ccq.org</a>></span><br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;"> +[...]<br> +Once we have the permission to use the name Mageia in MLO, we'll rename<br> +everything in our domain and get a new domain name. We'll have some breakage,<br> +but I estimated it'll be of no real consequences and easy to address.<br> +<br> +Pat<br> +</blockquote></div><br><br clear="all">Ok thanks, this is what i wanted to know ( il a du boulot! :) )<br><br>-- <br><div>Dimitrios Glentadakis</div><br> diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/c7111483/attachment-0001.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/c7111483/attachment-0001.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..de4299549 --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/c7111483/attachment-0001.html @@ -0,0 +1,18 @@ +<html> +<head> +<style><!-- +.hmmessage P +{ +margin:0px; +padding:0px +} +body.hmmessage +{ +font-size: 10pt; +font-family:Tahoma +} +--></style> +</head> +<body class='hmmessage'> +<meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"><font class="Apple-style-span" face="arial, sans-serif" size="4"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 16px;"><meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"><span title="" style="background-color: rgb(230, 236, 249); color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ">I am not proposing to replace the "URPMI" by the "APT-RPM! </span><span title="">I'm proposing we change the "Rpmdrake" with "Synaptic" and keeping the "URPMI!<br></span><span title="" style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); ">The URPMI is very good, plus the "Rpmdrake" is horrible!<br><br></span><span title="" style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); ">We discuss these things before the programming work to eat. </span><span title="" style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); ">We must define how the O.S should be! </span><span title="" style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); ">this discussion is important because the GUI package management directly influences the daily work in an OS!<br><br></span><span title="" style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); ">My proposal is that we keep the rpm and urpmi! </span><span title="" style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); ">But substitute Rpmdrake by Synaptic, and creating a second interface aimed at users with less knowledge.</span></span></font> </body> +</html>
\ No newline at end of file diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/c7111483/attachment.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/c7111483/attachment.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..de4299549 --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/c7111483/attachment.html @@ -0,0 +1,18 @@ +<html> +<head> +<style><!-- +.hmmessage P +{ +margin:0px; +padding:0px +} +body.hmmessage +{ +font-size: 10pt; +font-family:Tahoma +} +--></style> +</head> +<body class='hmmessage'> +<meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"><font class="Apple-style-span" face="arial, sans-serif" size="4"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 16px;"><meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"><span title="" style="background-color: rgb(230, 236, 249); color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ">I am not proposing to replace the "URPMI" by the "APT-RPM! </span><span title="">I'm proposing we change the "Rpmdrake" with "Synaptic" and keeping the "URPMI!<br></span><span title="" style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); ">The URPMI is very good, plus the "Rpmdrake" is horrible!<br><br></span><span title="" style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); ">We discuss these things before the programming work to eat. </span><span title="" style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); ">We must define how the O.S should be! </span><span title="" style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); ">this discussion is important because the GUI package management directly influences the daily work in an OS!<br><br></span><span title="" style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); ">My proposal is that we keep the rpm and urpmi! </span><span title="" style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); ">But substitute Rpmdrake by Synaptic, and creating a second interface aimed at users with less knowledge.</span></span></font> </body> +</html>
\ No newline at end of file diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/d86d751b/attachment-0001.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/d86d751b/attachment-0001.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..2a67c33f6 --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/d86d751b/attachment-0001.html @@ -0,0 +1,2 @@ +<br>I believe that is one of our reputation the urpmi and rpm. I think that is an excellent combination with the quality of rpm ( i prefer than deb) and the speed and performance of urpmi (the best rpm tool)<br><br><br clear="all"> +<br>-- <br><div>Dimitrios Glentadakis</div><br> diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/d86d751b/attachment.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/d86d751b/attachment.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..2a67c33f6 --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/d86d751b/attachment.html @@ -0,0 +1,2 @@ +<br>I believe that is one of our reputation the urpmi and rpm. I think that is an excellent combination with the quality of rpm ( i prefer than deb) and the speed and performance of urpmi (the best rpm tool)<br><br><br clear="all"> +<br>-- <br><div>Dimitrios Glentadakis</div><br> diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/fa0f153a/attachment-0001.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/fa0f153a/attachment-0001.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..ca257c000 --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/fa0f153a/attachment-0001.html @@ -0,0 +1,49 @@ +<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN"> +<html> + <head> + <meta content="text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1" + http-equiv="Content-Type"> + </head> + <body text="#000000" bgcolor="#ffffff"> + <br> + <br> + Le 25/09/2010 22:12, Mihai Dobrescu a écrit : + <blockquote + cite="mid:AANLkTinbPTpB1vMtfAjANMLk4qknjJNVdwD_y6Tm_ACu@mail.gmail.com" + type="cite"><br> + <br> + <div class="gmail_quote">On Sat, Sep 25, 2010 at 11:05 PM, Hoyt + Duff <span dir="ltr"><<a moz-do-not-send="true" + href="mailto:hoytduff@gmail.com">hoytduff@gmail.com</a>></span> + wrote:<br> + <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt + 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); + padding-left: 1ex;"> + <div class="im">On Sat, Sep 25, 2010 at 2:47 AM, JUAN CARLOS + <<a moz-do-not-send="true" + href="mailto:carlos.gilarranz@gmail.com">carlos.gilarranz@gmail.com</a>> + wrote:<br> + > First, my English is not good but I try<br> + ><br> + > Second, as the icon theme, appearance and others + believe it would be better<br> + > if it were completely different and a crystal + environment.<br> + ><br> + <br> + </div> + I agree. The look needs to be completely different.<br> + <br> + <br> + --<br> + <font color="#888888">Hoyt<br> + </font></blockquote> + </div> + <br> + Me too.<br> + </blockquote> + So do I. For both environments (kde and gnome), kde looks too much + like w$$ and gnome old fashioned (moreover the choices for changing + themes is limited).<br> + </body> +</html> diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/fa0f153a/attachment-0001.vcf b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/fa0f153a/attachment-0001.vcf new file mode 100644 index 000000000..ab0a909d8 --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/fa0f153a/attachment-0001.vcf @@ -0,0 +1,11 @@ +begin:vcard +fn:David Naura +n:Naura;David +org:Lindom EURL +adr:;;L'Iris 12 ch de Beauregard;Aix en PRovence;;13100;France +email;internet:david.naura@lindom.fr +tel;work:06 11 85 11 22 +url:http://www.lindom.fr +version:2.1 +end:vcard + diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/fa0f153a/attachment.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/fa0f153a/attachment.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..ca257c000 --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/fa0f153a/attachment.html @@ -0,0 +1,49 @@ +<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN"> +<html> + <head> + <meta content="text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1" + http-equiv="Content-Type"> + </head> + <body text="#000000" bgcolor="#ffffff"> + <br> + <br> + Le 25/09/2010 22:12, Mihai Dobrescu a écrit : + <blockquote + cite="mid:AANLkTinbPTpB1vMtfAjANMLk4qknjJNVdwD_y6Tm_ACu@mail.gmail.com" + type="cite"><br> + <br> + <div class="gmail_quote">On Sat, Sep 25, 2010 at 11:05 PM, Hoyt + Duff <span dir="ltr"><<a moz-do-not-send="true" + href="mailto:hoytduff@gmail.com">hoytduff@gmail.com</a>></span> + wrote:<br> + <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt + 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); + padding-left: 1ex;"> + <div class="im">On Sat, Sep 25, 2010 at 2:47 AM, JUAN CARLOS + <<a moz-do-not-send="true" + href="mailto:carlos.gilarranz@gmail.com">carlos.gilarranz@gmail.com</a>> + wrote:<br> + > First, my English is not good but I try<br> + ><br> + > Second, as the icon theme, appearance and others + believe it would be better<br> + > if it were completely different and a crystal + environment.<br> + ><br> + <br> + </div> + I agree. The look needs to be completely different.<br> + <br> + <br> + --<br> + <font color="#888888">Hoyt<br> + </font></blockquote> + </div> + <br> + Me too.<br> + </blockquote> + So do I. For both environments (kde and gnome), kde looks too much + like w$$ and gnome old fashioned (moreover the choices for changing + themes is limited).<br> + </body> +</html> diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/fa0f153a/attachment.vcf b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/fa0f153a/attachment.vcf new file mode 100644 index 000000000..ab0a909d8 --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/fa0f153a/attachment.vcf @@ -0,0 +1,11 @@ +begin:vcard +fn:David Naura +n:Naura;David +org:Lindom EURL +adr:;;L'Iris 12 ch de Beauregard;Aix en PRovence;;13100;France +email;internet:david.naura@lindom.fr +tel;work:06 11 85 11 22 +url:http://www.lindom.fr +version:2.1 +end:vcard + diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/fd965529/attachment-0001.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/fd965529/attachment-0001.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..7286eb1c2 --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/fd965529/attachment-0001.html @@ -0,0 +1,40 @@ +<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN"> +<html> +<head> + <meta content="text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1" + http-equiv="Content-Type"> + <title></title> +</head> +<body bgcolor="#ffffff" text="#000000"> +On 09/27/2010 07:55 PM, Hoyt Duff wrote: +<blockquote + cite="mid:AANLkTiktREz+3ca_hA1KGmkPxZv7jxWN9VT+jgMfRZn0@mail.gmail.com" + type="cite"> + <pre wrap="">On Mon, Sep 27, 2010 at 3:05 PM, Florian Hubold <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:doktor5000@arcor.de"><doktor5000@arcor.de></a> wrote: + </pre> + <blockquote type="cite"> + <pre wrap=""> Am 23.09.2010 14:33, schrieb Wolfgang Bornath: + </pre> + <blockquote type="cite"> + <pre wrap=""> +Yes, of course, I was in generalising mode (many US Americans seem to +think that all Germans run around in Lederhosen, drinking beer and +eating Sauerkraut, listening to Blaskapelle and singing about +Gemütlichkeit). + </pre> + </blockquote> + <pre wrap=""> + </pre> + </blockquote> + <pre wrap=""> +Those I see on TV are drinking beer. But most Germans I see on US TV +are beer-drinking sausage-eating WW!!-vintage soldiers with British +accents, so reality is not heavily involved in any perception. + + + </pre> +</blockquote> +<font size="+1">I was going to say that the 60s TV show "Hogan's Heros" +would be most US folks impression of Germans. </font><br> +</body> +</html> diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/fd965529/attachment.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/fd965529/attachment.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..7286eb1c2 --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/attachments/20100927/fd965529/attachment.html @@ -0,0 +1,40 @@ +<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN"> +<html> +<head> + <meta content="text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1" + http-equiv="Content-Type"> + <title></title> +</head> +<body bgcolor="#ffffff" text="#000000"> +On 09/27/2010 07:55 PM, Hoyt Duff wrote: +<blockquote + cite="mid:AANLkTiktREz+3ca_hA1KGmkPxZv7jxWN9VT+jgMfRZn0@mail.gmail.com" + type="cite"> + <pre wrap="">On Mon, Sep 27, 2010 at 3:05 PM, Florian Hubold <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:doktor5000@arcor.de"><doktor5000@arcor.de></a> wrote: + </pre> + <blockquote type="cite"> + <pre wrap=""> Am 23.09.2010 14:33, schrieb Wolfgang Bornath: + </pre> + <blockquote type="cite"> + <pre wrap=""> +Yes, of course, I was in generalising mode (many US Americans seem to +think that all Germans run around in Lederhosen, drinking beer and +eating Sauerkraut, listening to Blaskapelle and singing about +Gemütlichkeit). + </pre> + </blockquote> + <pre wrap=""> + </pre> + </blockquote> + <pre wrap=""> +Those I see on TV are drinking beer. But most Germans I see on US TV +are beer-drinking sausage-eating WW!!-vintage soldiers with British +accents, so reality is not heavily involved in any perception. + + + </pre> +</blockquote> +<font size="+1">I was going to say that the 60s TV show "Hogan's Heros" +would be most US folks impression of Germans. </font><br> +</body> +</html> |