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diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/20101026/002678.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/20101026/002678.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..c98f05ee6 --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/20101026/002678.html @@ -0,0 +1,152 @@ +<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 3.2//EN"> +<HTML> + <HEAD> + <TITLE> [Mageia-discuss] Suggestions + </TITLE> + <LINK REL="Index" HREF="index.html" > + <LINK REL="made" HREF="mailto:mageia-discuss%40mageia.org?Subject=Re%3A%20%5BMageia-discuss%5D%20Suggestions&In-Reply-To=%3Calpine.LMD.2.00.1010260824130.12968%40astro.scholar.athome%3E"> + <META NAME="robots" CONTENT="index,nofollow"> + <META http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=us-ascii"> + <LINK REL="Previous" HREF="002680.html"> + <LINK REL="Next" HREF="002659.html"> + </HEAD> + <BODY BGCOLOR="#ffffff"> + <H1>[Mageia-discuss] Suggestions</H1> + <B>Dale Huckeby</B> + <A HREF="mailto:mageia-discuss%40mageia.org?Subject=Re%3A%20%5BMageia-discuss%5D%20Suggestions&In-Reply-To=%3Calpine.LMD.2.00.1010260824130.12968%40astro.scholar.athome%3E" + TITLE="[Mageia-discuss] Suggestions">spock at evansville.net + </A><BR> + <I>Tue Oct 26 16:00:32 CEST 2010</I> + <P><UL> + <LI>Previous message: <A HREF="002680.html">[Mageia-discuss] Suggestions +</A></li> + <LI>Next message: <A HREF="002659.html">[Mageia-discuss] network balancing by default +</A></li> + <LI> <B>Messages sorted by:</B> + <a href="date.html#2678">[ date ]</a> + <a href="thread.html#2678">[ thread ]</a> + <a href="subject.html#2678">[ subject ]</a> + <a href="author.html#2678">[ author ]</a> + </LI> + </UL> + <HR> +<!--beginarticle--> +<PRE>On Tue, 26 Oct 2010, Michael Scherer wrote: + +><i> Le mardi 26 octobre 2010 à 02:28 +0200, Wolfgang Bornath a écrit : +</I>><i> +</I>>><i> In the individual package selection at system installation all these +</I>>><i> descriptions are missing completely. +</I>>><i> If somebody wants to pimp his installation and searches for +</I>>><i> applications to be installed at system installation time all he sees +</I>>><i> is the category (example: office), the package name and version and +</I>>><i> then a mere "useful" or "important" or "comfortable.", etc. Nobody +</I>>><i> tells him (examples:) what bvi is and how should he know what +</I>>><i> "alexandria" does (is it an egyptian font?). This is where the +</I>>><i> descriptions are missing completely although they are available in the +</I>>><i> packages! +</I>>><i> +</I>>><i> So, here the task is to include the descriptions in the installer and +</I>>><i> providing the translations as in rpmdrake. +</I>>><i> +</I>>><i> As we can see most parts of the package description issue are not +</I>>><i> related to packagers, rather to developpers of rpmdrake and the +</I>>><i> installer - and to the translators, of course. +</I>><i> +</I>><i> To the defense of the drakx developpers, I do not think that choosing in +</I>><i> the installer is really a so good idea : +</I> +It might not be a good idea, but I like to do it, anyway. I ALWAYS check +individual package selection, I like to install stuff to check out, and +I find it difficult to make choices when description is lacking. + +><i> - during installation, you do not have web access. Thus, you will have a +</I>><i> hardtime to really find information on what does a software. If you use +</I>><i> rpmdrake, you can ask to friend, ask on forum, ask on a search engine. +</I>><i> +</I>><i> - during installation, you do nothing except looking at installation. +</I>><i> That's fine, but IMHO, it is better to have a fast installation, and +</I>><i> later be able to listen to music, etc, while installing software. +</I> +Can't speak for others, but it's not better for me. I'm NOT in a hurry +during installation, and I'm not concerned about listening to music +or otherwise entertaining myself. The installation process IS the +entertainment for me, although I realize I might not be representative. + +><i> - looking at software in drakx or in rpmdrake will likely take the same +</I>><i> time. If you take 1h to select rpm in drakx, you will likely spend 1h in +</I>><i> rpmdrake. The computing is taking less time that the human mind to +</I>><i> decide. Of course, people will perceive differently ( ie they will feel +</I>><i> the installation is incomplete if they need to do thing after the first +</I>><i> boot, even if they have to do the exact same task taking the exact same +</I>><i> time in drakx and rpmdrake ), but then that's just a perception. +</I>><i> Unfortunately, perception is what count more than reality. +</I> +It's my perception that I like cherry pie and lemonade and it's my +perception that I like to have descriptions of packages when I'm doing +an install. If that's not feasible, or if it's not fair to a majority +whose needs it conflicts with, that's one thing. But telling people +what they ought or ought not to like is spitting in the wind. + +><i> So why don't we have this description. I am not sure about this, but I +</I>><i> think drakx use synthesis hdlists, ie a shorter version oof the packages +</I>><i> index. And parsing description is one of the reason rpmdrake is spending +</I>><i> time at startup. Synthesis is 750 k big, hdlist is 46 m big. There is a +</I>><i> huge gap. This would take place on the cd, this take place in memory, +</I>><i> and this make drakx be slower when solving dependency ( even if I do not +</I>><i> know how much slower it would be, maybe that's negligible with nowadays +</I>><i> computer ). +</I>><i> +</I>><i> Then, in order to accelerate the installation for the people who do not +</I>><i> select package one by one at install time ( that's IMHO the common use +</I>><i> case of drakx ), part of the confort of those that does was sacrified, +</I>><i> mainly because this feature is aimed to advanced users more than new +</I>><i> users discovering Linux ( who would and should take the easiest road of +</I>><i> keeping default selection ). +</I>><i> +</I>><i> I think drakx could implement the required behavior, but I do not think +</I>><i> it would come with problem by itself. And so, we need to evaluate the +</I>><i> rpos and cons of the change ( and as I said, I think the current +</I>><i> situation is better for a majority of users ). +</I> +Whether or not the points you make are valid, and I can see some sense +in them, in the three paragraphs above you address the relevant issues +of space utilization (on the DVD) and the wishes or needs of perhaps +the majority of users. + +><i> Finally, in order to mitigate the issue, I would propose to add a +</I>><i> warning or a label saying "this is for advanced users, we suggest you to +</I>><i> do the customization after installation, as we would be able to show +</I>><i> more informations about packages". This would not solve anything for +</I>><i> people who still want to do it in drakx, of course, but at least, it +</I>><i> will explain how to have a better experience for the new user. I am not +</I>><i> sure if we should add explanation about why it is like this ( maybe too +</I>><i> technical ). +</I> +Don't have any problem with that. + +Dale Huckeby +</PRE> + + + +<!--endarticle--> + <HR> + <P><UL> + <!--threads--> + <LI>Previous message: <A HREF="002680.html">[Mageia-discuss] Suggestions +</A></li> + <LI>Next message: <A HREF="002659.html">[Mageia-discuss] network balancing by default +</A></li> + <LI> <B>Messages sorted by:</B> + <a href="date.html#2678">[ date ]</a> + <a href="thread.html#2678">[ thread ]</a> + <a href="subject.html#2678">[ subject ]</a> + <a href="author.html#2678">[ author ]</a> + </LI> + </UL> + +<hr> +<a href="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-discuss">More information about the Mageia-discuss +mailing list</a><br> +</body></html> |