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diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/20101017/002438.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/20101017/002438.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..146555567 --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/20101017/002438.html @@ -0,0 +1,194 @@ +<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 3.2//EN"> +<HTML> + <HEAD> + <TITLE> [Mageia-discuss] Mageia logo proposals and selection + </TITLE> + <LINK REL="Index" HREF="index.html" > + <LINK REL="made" HREF="mailto:mageia-discuss%40mageia.org?Subject=Re%3A%20%5BMageia-discuss%5D%20Mageia%20logo%20proposals%20and%20selection&In-Reply-To=%3C4CBAB2DE.2000902%40laposte.net%3E"> + <META NAME="robots" CONTENT="index,nofollow"> + <META http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=us-ascii"> + <LINK REL="Previous" HREF="002436.html"> + <LINK REL="Next" HREF="002439.html"> + </HEAD> + <BODY BGCOLOR="#ffffff"> + <H1>[Mageia-discuss] Mageia logo proposals and selection</H1> + <B>andré</B> + <A HREF="mailto:mageia-discuss%40mageia.org?Subject=Re%3A%20%5BMageia-discuss%5D%20Mageia%20logo%20proposals%20and%20selection&In-Reply-To=%3C4CBAB2DE.2000902%40laposte.net%3E" + TITLE="[Mageia-discuss] Mageia logo proposals and selection">andr55 at laposte.net + </A><BR> + <I>Sun Oct 17 10:25:02 CEST 2010</I> + <P><UL> + <LI>Previous message: <A HREF="002436.html">[Mageia-discuss] Mageia logo proposals and selection +</A></li> + <LI>Next message: <A HREF="002439.html">[Mageia-discuss] Mageia logo proposals and selection +</A></li> + <LI> <B>Messages sorted by:</B> + <a href="date.html#2438">[ date ]</a> + <a href="thread.html#2438">[ thread ]</a> + <a href="subject.html#2438">[ subject ]</a> + <a href="author.html#2438">[ author ]</a> + </LI> + </UL> + <HR> +<!--beginarticle--> +<PRE>Graham Lauder a écrit : +><i> On Thursday 14 Oct 2010 16:16:39 Tux99 wrote: +</I>><i> +</I>>><i> On Thu, 14 Oct 2010, Graham Lauder wrote: +</I>>><i> +</I>>>><i> It is a well known fact, that you cannot be all things to all people, to +</I>>>><i> try to do that would end up being everything to noone. I would prefer +</I>>>><i> to be the best we can be to those who grow to love the brand. +</I>>>><i> +</I>>><i> True, but you are forgetting to take into account the views of the +</I>>><i> developers and packagers of Mageia. Without them there will be no Mageia +</I>>><i> distro and since partecipation is on an unpaid volunteer basis, no +</I>>><i> grand plan of shaping the distro from a marketing POV will succeed, if +</I>>><i> it doesn't match the views of a large part of the devs and packagers. +</I>>><i> +</I>><i> What has that got to do with it, there is always an internal component to the +</I>><i> marketing, goes without saying +</I>><i> +</I>That has everything to do with it. Without contributors, Mageia does +not exist. +As simple as that. +><i> +</I>>><i> This is not a criticism of your work (which I'm sure is well meant), but +</I>>><i> it's a simple but crucial fact that you have to take into account. +</I>>><i> +</I>><i> Damned by faint praise, and frankly I'm insulted, I suggest you read the Core +</I>><i> Values statement which is up on the website now I think and which I and my +</I>><i> team put together in deep consultation with the founders. +</I>You may be making useful contributions, but your attitude towards others +opinions does not make you welcome. A little less arrogance would be +appreciated. +By the way, the core values statement definitely needs refining, +although it is a start. In general, it is not surprising for a +community-based open source distribution. But not (yet) a work of art. +>>><i> All linux distributions at the moment have a less than 1.5% of the total +</I>>>><i> market, however in the area where they have targeted a particular user +</I>>>><i> set, Webservers, the market penetration is somewhere around the 65% +</I>>>><i> mark. +</I>>>><i> +</I>>><i> And that's because of the simple fact that Linux is the best technical +</I>>><i> choice for that specific application and the decisionmakers are techies +</I>>><i> who know that, it has nothing to do with marketing. +</I>>><i> If anything it shows how marketing counts for nothing when techies and +</I>>><i> experts make choices. +</I>>><i> +</I>><i> I'm really trying to be restrained here but I think you should talk to RedHat +</I>><i> and SuSE and so forth the companies that have driven most of that market and +</I>><i> ask them if the did no marketing. +</I>><i> +</I>You could at least have the courtesy to acknowlege the point. +Of course one can market on the basis of technical traits. But that is +not what you are proposing for Mageia. At least not in your postings. +>>><i> How many users does Mandriva have worldwide, compare that to the number +</I>>>><i> of computer users and you will see that the "one size fits all" does not +</I>>>><i> equal significant market share. +</I>>>><i> +</I>>><i> Mandriva is not a "one size fits all". It is the best Linux desktop +</I>>><i> distro, but it's not the best choice as a server distro or for many +</I>>><i> other uses. +</I>>><i> The fact that it doesn't have more users is primarily due to the unfair +</I>>><i> advantage that Windows has because it comes preinstalled on PCs. +</I>>><i> +</I>><i> That is in fact patently untrue, I remember when Mandrake was trumpeting the +</I>><i> fact that you could buy it preinstalled back about 9.0 I think, can't +</I>><i> remember. +</I>But only if you lived in France at the time. Where market penetration +is a bit more impressive. +However, virtually every computer comes with Microsoft preinstalled. +(And the ms tax included.) Being honest, you should acknowledge his +point, which is clearly well founded. But that would be the high road ... +><i> MS spends 500 million a year on marketing, just to maintain that +</I>><i> market share. +</I>><i> +</I>And how much of that goes to campaign contributions and the like. Or is +that in addition to the 500 million ? +>>><i> OOo is targeted at office productivity people for obvious reasons, +</I>>>><i> it's branding, colour design (Blue engenders a feeling of reliability +</I>>>><i> and efficiency) is aimed at that market group. The Logo design is +</I>>>><i> aimed at a 30 to 45 age group, who are the decision makers in this group +</I>>>><i> and to whom "Gulls" = Freedom. +</I>>>><i> +</I>>><i> I very much doubt any OOo user chose it because of the logo, personally +</I>>><i> I chose software on technical and usability merits, not logo design and +</I>>><i> even all non-techies I know do the same. +</I>>><i> +</I>><i> Oh for crying out loud is there a virus around here that imbues density... +</I>Logical point. Just who has the virus ? +><i> OF +</I>><i> COURSE they didn't choose because of the Logo, ye gods if you so much as had +</I>><i> an inkling of the smallest piece of Marketing science you would see how +</I>><i> nonsensical that statement is in terms of what we are talking about, +</I>><i> +</I>So in other words, you agree that the logo is *not* important to why +people chose software. So why have you been trumpeting choosing the +right logo for the target market ? +><i> especially when you say it as though you have a deep dark knowledge. I don't +</I>><i> really have time to do marketing 101 here and It's wasting my time when I +</I>><i> could be doing the more useful things that the Founders have asked us to do. +</I>><i> +</I>><i> However: +</I>><i> Marketing raises Brand awareness +</I>><i> It connects a value with the product in the Consumers mind +</I>><i> It connects a brand with people on an emotional level +</I>><i> +</I>><i> That's it, Getting people to use it is Sales which is a different beast +</I>><i> altogether. +</I>><i> +</I>><i> We get people to see the brand, connect with the brand and then think about +</I>><i> investigating it after that it's sales and engineering. +</I>><i> +</I>><i> +</I>>><i> Software is not a car or a handbag or a jacket, those are items where +</I>>><i> looks and design counts a lot, with software the only design that counts +</I>>><i> is UI interface design aimed at maximising usability. +</I>>><i> +</I>><i> +</I>><i> There is an old saying there are none so blind as those that will not see, and +</I>><i> +</I>Yes indeed. Have you looked in a mirror lately ? +><i> it doesn't matter how good the UI is, if no-one looks at it, it's the same for +</I>><i> anything, you can make it as pretty and as usable as you want if nobody knows +</I>><i> the brand exists then the only ones that will connect are the ones that +</I>><i> stumble across it accidentally. +</I>><i> +</I>><i> Once more, this is wasting my time and there is no point in discussing this +</I>><i> with a closed mind and entrenched attitudes. +</I>><i> +</I>You could try to be a little less arrogant, a little more polite, and a +little more coherent. It might lower your blood pressure a bit. And it +certainly would be appreciated by the community. +><i> GL +</I>><i> +</I>><i> +</I>Sorry if you take offense at my comments, but frankly, your attitude +towards other's opinions borders on intolerable. And I strongly dislike +seeing others abused for politely expressing entirely reasonable opinions. + +- André +</PRE> + + +<!--endarticle--> + <HR> + <P><UL> + <!--threads--> + <LI>Previous message: <A HREF="002436.html">[Mageia-discuss] Mageia logo proposals and selection +</A></li> + <LI>Next message: <A HREF="002439.html">[Mageia-discuss] Mageia logo proposals and selection +</A></li> + <LI> <B>Messages sorted by:</B> + <a href="date.html#2438">[ date ]</a> + <a href="thread.html#2438">[ thread ]</a> + <a href="subject.html#2438">[ subject ]</a> + <a href="author.html#2438">[ author ]</a> + </LI> + </UL> + +<hr> +<a href="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-discuss">More information about the Mageia-discuss +mailing list</a><br> +</body></html> |