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diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/20101001/002127.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/20101001/002127.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..9fd2d1a4e --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/20101001/002127.html @@ -0,0 +1,180 @@ +<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 3.2//EN"> +<HTML> + <HEAD> + <TITLE> [Mageia-discuss] About Mandriva tools future : Host Mandriva tools on github + </TITLE> + <LINK REL="Index" HREF="index.html" > + <LINK REL="made" HREF="mailto:mageia-discuss%40mageia.org?Subject=Re%3A%20%5BMageia-discuss%5D%20About%20Mandriva%20tools%20future%20%3A%20Host%20Mandriva%0A%20tools%20on%20github&In-Reply-To=%3C4CA5D3B2.10704%40gmail.com%3E"> + <META NAME="robots" CONTENT="index,nofollow"> + <META http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=us-ascii"> + <LINK REL="Previous" HREF="001715.html"> + <LINK REL="Next" HREF="001718.html"> + </HEAD> + <BODY BGCOLOR="#ffffff"> + <H1>[Mageia-discuss] About Mandriva tools future : Host Mandriva tools on github</H1> + <B>Thomas Lottmann</B> + <A HREF="mailto:mageia-discuss%40mageia.org?Subject=Re%3A%20%5BMageia-discuss%5D%20About%20Mandriva%20tools%20future%20%3A%20Host%20Mandriva%0A%20tools%20on%20github&In-Reply-To=%3C4CA5D3B2.10704%40gmail.com%3E" + TITLE="[Mageia-discuss] About Mandriva tools future : Host Mandriva tools on github">skipercooker at gmail.com + </A><BR> + <I>Fri Oct 1 14:27:30 CEST 2010</I> + <P><UL> + <LI>Previous message: <A HREF="001715.html">[Mageia-discuss] About Mandriva tools future : Host Mandriva tools on github +</A></li> + <LI>Next message: <A HREF="001718.html">[Mageia-discuss] About Mandriva tools future : Host Mandriva tools on github +</A></li> + <LI> <B>Messages sorted by:</B> + <a href="date.html#2127">[ date ]</a> + <a href="thread.html#2127">[ thread ]</a> + <a href="subject.html#2127">[ subject ]</a> + <a href="author.html#2127">[ author ]</a> + </LI> + </UL> + <HR> +<!--beginarticle--> +<PRE> Le 01/10/2010 12:38, Fabrice Facorat a écrit : +><i> I've been following closely all the Mandriva vs Mageia story. I found +</I>><i> it unfortunate that we have to come to this way, but I guess there's a +</I>><i> serious fracture between Mandriva and part of its community. We have +</I>><i> no choice except to cope with this and try to do our best to allow +</I>><i> this unfortunate situation to found a sensible solution in the future. +</I>><i> +</I>><i> As we know, one of the Mandriva strenght are the Mandriva tools, +</I>><i> however Mandriva tools have some issues : +</I>><i> - they are written in perl. Sorry for perl dev, but I do still think +</I>><i> that perl is harder to understand than C-like based syntax langages. +</I>><i> However we must admit that we are not going to rewrite all the +</I>><i> Mandriva tools ;-) However better documentation ( PerlDoc tags ) could +</I>><i> help a little. +</I>><i> +</I>><i> - Mandriva tools are not used by others distributions ( except +</I>><i> PCLinuxOS, United Linux, and ... Mageia ) and so have few external +</I>><i> contributions : They notably lack visibility. +</I> +I do agree with this. + +><i> I do think also that Mandriva will have to use its ressources in an +</I>><i> efficient way. +</I>><i> +</I>><i> Here aree my proposals, feel free to discuss : +</I>><i> +</I>><i> 1. host Mandriva tools on github or code.google.com. This will ease +</I>><i> fork maintenance and tracking, to contribute back ( without having to +</I>><i> have a Mandriva account ) +</I> +Yes. Having their own 'site' and independent platform may help. + +><i> 2. Make some decisions about the tools we should keep, and the ones we +</I>><i> should ... trash. For example we did replace printerdrake with +</I>><i> system-config-printer ( python ), and msec have been rewritten ( +</I>><i> python ). Whereas I do think that system-config-printer is way buggier +</I>><i> than printerdrake, I guess that at some points, we will have to do +</I>><i> this more and more : replace some Mandriva tools with for example some +</I>><i> Fedora ones. Please note however that this bring its own issues : +</I>><i> python vs perl, and the integration with the rest of Mandriva +</I>><i> infrastructure +</I> +We need to see what is still functional, what is broken (and so what is +to repair), and what is to drop. Eventually, what is to support and +repair again (printerdrake?) if possible. + +For what I know, there are many tools that work : RPMDrake and related, +Drakstats, Diskdrake, Harddrake, DrakX11, Drak3D, DrakUPS, DrakFirewall, +DrakGuard (wonderful this one) but may networking tools to share network +or use VPN, Samba, NFS, WebDav, and eventually along with Diskdrake, are +broken. Others such as Draksnapshot and DrakSamba (not sure if it works +or not) are a pain due to insufficient functionalities or +outdated/painful GUI. There is a nice theming functionality in the MCC +that is also probably broken or difficult to use, that could be restored +or explained. + +><i> 3. A decision will have to be made concerning net_applet and NetworkManager +</I> +Yes, even though I think we should give another chance to NetApplet and +see what should be fixed to make it better. NetAppler has the advantages +of being linked to DrakFirewall, perhaps other tools, and to be +independent of any environment. + +><i> 4. Whereas I do love rpmdrake, I do think also that something will +</I>><i> have to be done about it as its UI is clearly outdated and not on par +</I>><i> with the competition : +</I>><i> - Ubuntu software center : +</I>><i> <A HREF="http://seilo.geekyogre.com/2010/09/software-center-with-a-dose-of-zeitgeist-and-maybe-teamgeist/">http://seilo.geekyogre.com/2010/09/software-center-with-a-dose-of-zeitgeist-and-maybe-teamgeist/</A> +</I>><i> , <A HREF="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ubuntu_Software_Center">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ubuntu_Software_Center</A> , +</I>><i> <A HREF="https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SoftwareCenter">https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SoftwareCenter</A> +</I>><i> - iTunes App Store : +</I>><i> <A HREF="http://www.askdavetaylor.com/how_to_download_iphone_apps_from_apple_itunes_store.html">http://www.askdavetaylor.com/how_to_download_iphone_apps_from_apple_itunes_store.html</A> +</I>><i> , <A HREF="http://cybernetnews.com/download-iphone-firmware-20-itunes-77-app-store-and-more/">http://cybernetnews.com/download-iphone-firmware-20-itunes-77-app-store-and-more/</A> +</I>><i> - Interesting discussion about PackageKit direction : +</I>><i> <A HREF="http://mairin.wordpress.com/2010/09/01/a-story-about-updates-and-people/">http://mairin.wordpress.com/2010/09/01/a-story-about-updates-and-people/</A> +</I>><i> +</I>><i> So we may have to completely rewrite rpmdrake UI or switch to +</I>><i> packagekit with and urpmi backend. +</I> +I still have a very strong faith and appreciation for RPMDrake. I really +think it is well designed and intuitive, despite it's little issues and +being slow (honestly, PackageKit is slow and also has issues so...). + +The real issue that RPMDrake has is it's Aplications with GUI filter. +Even if I think this functionalitiy is really good for beginners, +RPMDrake is a -package- manager. Mandriva does need a real and dedicated +Application manager (could be called an AppCenter) where beginners would +find a way to install (shop?) applications with a very nice layout, +presentation, clear icons, screenshot, and no irritating choice of +hundreds of dependencies with barbaric names. +It might be difficult, but much more convenient for those who just want +things to work in a snap (or in very few clicks). + +This would allow to place back again the default filter on "All" (should +be renamed to "Show all packages") for the RPMDrake package manager. We +would then have an AppCenter and a real package manager for advanced +package management, without forgetting a dedicated tool with GUI to +manage orphans more efficiently. + +Yet, all of this demands a huge lot of work and we will need huge +resources... + +><i> 5. Junior tasks contributions. I noticed while visiting the +</I>><i> LibreOffice website. They have junior task for people willing to +</I>><i> contribute to the codebase, and most of theses junior tasks consist to +</I>><i> improve code clarity, fix comments. I guess that the same thing could +</I>><i> be done with Mandriva tools, notably adding perldoc tags/comments. +</I> +Yes. This will help people from outside understand better how the +program works. Reading the code itself isn't that easy even if it is +well written. + +><i> Last but not least, I know that on Mageia ML, there was a discussion +</I>><i> about the people we should target. Here are some interesting +</I>><i> reflexions : +</I>><i> Sweet Caroline : <A HREF="http://mairin.wordpress.com/2010/09/02/sweet-caroline/">http://mairin.wordpress.com/2010/09/02/sweet-caroline/</A> +</I>><i> fedoraproject.org redesign update : +</I>><i> <A HREF="http://mairin.wordpress.com/2010/09/03/fedoraproject-org-redesign-update/">http://mairin.wordpress.com/2010/09/03/fedoraproject-org-redesign-update/</A> +</I>><i> You must be this tall to ride: __ : +</I>><i> <A HREF="http://mairin.wordpress.com/2010/10/01/you-must-be-this-tall-to-ride-_">http://mairin.wordpress.com/2010/10/01/you-must-be-this-tall-to-ride-_</A>_ +</I> +Will read them when I'll find the time to... + +Thomas. + +</PRE> + +<!--endarticle--> + <HR> + <P><UL> + <!--threads--> + <LI>Previous message: <A HREF="001715.html">[Mageia-discuss] About Mandriva tools future : Host Mandriva tools on github +</A></li> + <LI>Next message: <A HREF="001718.html">[Mageia-discuss] About Mandriva tools future : Host Mandriva tools on github +</A></li> + <LI> <B>Messages sorted by:</B> + <a href="date.html#2127">[ date ]</a> + <a href="thread.html#2127">[ thread ]</a> + <a href="subject.html#2127">[ subject ]</a> + <a href="author.html#2127">[ author ]</a> + </LI> + </UL> + +<hr> +<a href="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-discuss">More information about the Mageia-discuss +mailing list</a><br> +</body></html> |