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diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-dev/attachments/20110113/b99ffec2/attachment-0001.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-dev/attachments/20110113/b99ffec2/attachment-0001.html
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+<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN">
+<html>
+<head>
+ <meta content="text/html; charset=UTF-8" http-equiv="Content-Type">
+</head>
+<body bgcolor="#ffffff" text="#000000">
+Daniel Kreuter wrote:
+<blockquote
+ cite="mid:AANLkTik_goSz3Rybp0M0p5YJZ94phafiKWPhPNjvLRqh@mail.gmail.com"
+ type="cite"><br>
+I don't agree with you at that point. I always take the tarball from <a
+ moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://eclipse.org">eclipse.org</a> (for
+eclipse) or <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://netbeans.org">netbeans.org</a>
+(for netbeans) instead of the one's of repository provided by the
+distro.<br>
+The reason is quite simple, the one's mentioned above are newer than
+the one's in the repos (often, not always but everywhere i looked for
+it, it was so)<br>
+ <br>
+But there may be people who will first look in rpmdrake or urpmi that's
+right, but not everybody.<br>
+</blockquote>
+<br>
+Well, I didn't say *everybody*, I was referring to newer users who
+might actually do what we tell them to :-)<br>
+<br>
+The problem is that there is a very high probability that anyone who
+installs from an RPM will then install plugins directly.  Given that, I
+would question even packaging the base product as an RPM.<br>
+<br>
+Then again, there's the concern about whether an RPM-provided package
+may provide something a tarball does not, or vice-versa.  For example,
+the MDV Java RPMs play all sorts of games with /etc/alternatives and
+don't (I think) set environment variables like JAVA_HOME.  This means
+that tarball installs of things like Ant need manual tweaking to work
+correctly with an RPM-based JDK.  The RPM-based Ant has wrapper scripts
+which depend on the /etc/alternatives stuff and determine JAVA_HOME on
+the fly.<br>
+</body>
+</html>
diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-dev/attachments/20110113/b99ffec2/attachment.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-dev/attachments/20110113/b99ffec2/attachment.html
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--- /dev/null
+++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-dev/attachments/20110113/b99ffec2/attachment.html
@@ -0,0 +1,40 @@
+<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN">
+<html>
+<head>
+ <meta content="text/html; charset=UTF-8" http-equiv="Content-Type">
+</head>
+<body bgcolor="#ffffff" text="#000000">
+Daniel Kreuter wrote:
+<blockquote
+ cite="mid:AANLkTik_goSz3Rybp0M0p5YJZ94phafiKWPhPNjvLRqh@mail.gmail.com"
+ type="cite"><br>
+I don't agree with you at that point. I always take the tarball from <a
+ moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://eclipse.org">eclipse.org</a> (for
+eclipse) or <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://netbeans.org">netbeans.org</a>
+(for netbeans) instead of the one's of repository provided by the
+distro.<br>
+The reason is quite simple, the one's mentioned above are newer than
+the one's in the repos (often, not always but everywhere i looked for
+it, it was so)<br>
+ <br>
+But there may be people who will first look in rpmdrake or urpmi that's
+right, but not everybody.<br>
+</blockquote>
+<br>
+Well, I didn't say *everybody*, I was referring to newer users who
+might actually do what we tell them to :-)<br>
+<br>
+The problem is that there is a very high probability that anyone who
+installs from an RPM will then install plugins directly.  Given that, I
+would question even packaging the base product as an RPM.<br>
+<br>
+Then again, there's the concern about whether an RPM-provided package
+may provide something a tarball does not, or vice-versa.  For example,
+the MDV Java RPMs play all sorts of games with /etc/alternatives and
+don't (I think) set environment variables like JAVA_HOME.  This means
+that tarball installs of things like Ant need manual tweaking to work
+correctly with an RPM-based JDK.  The RPM-based Ant has wrapper scripts
+which depend on the /etc/alternatives stuff and determine JAVA_HOME on
+the fly.<br>
+</body>
+</html>
diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-dev/attachments/20110113/b9db44cb/attachment-0001.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-dev/attachments/20110113/b9db44cb/attachment-0001.html
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+++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-dev/attachments/20110113/b9db44cb/attachment-0001.html
@@ -0,0 +1,9 @@
+<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, Jan 13, 2011 at 2:01 AM, Frank Griffin <span dir="ltr">&lt;<a href="mailto:ftg@roadrunner.com">ftg@roadrunner.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;">
+No they won&#39;t.  They won&#39;t know anything about the distinction between<br>
+installing via RPM or via tarball.  They&#39;ll look in rpmdrake for Eclipse<br>
+initially, install it from there, and then use the normal Eclipse<br>
+mechanism to install plugins.  They&#39;ll do this because we tell them to<br>
+use rpmdrake to look for software, and they&#39;ll do the plugins the way<br>
+they&#39;re used to or the way the Eclipse docs tell them to.<br></blockquote></div><br>I don&#39;t agree with you at that point. I always take the tarball from <a href="http://eclipse.org">eclipse.org</a> (for eclipse) or <a href="http://netbeans.org">netbeans.org</a> (for netbeans) instead of the one&#39;s of repository provided by the distro.<br>
+The reason is quite simple, the one&#39;s mentioned above are newer than the one&#39;s in the repos (often, not always but everywhere i looked for it, it was so)<br><br>But there may be people who will first look in rpmdrake or urpmi that&#39;s right, but not everybody.<br>
+-- <br>Mit freundlichen Grüßen<br><br>Greetings<br><br>Daniel Kreuter<br><br><br><br>
diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-dev/attachments/20110113/b9db44cb/attachment.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-dev/attachments/20110113/b9db44cb/attachment.html
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@@ -0,0 +1,9 @@
+<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, Jan 13, 2011 at 2:01 AM, Frank Griffin <span dir="ltr">&lt;<a href="mailto:ftg@roadrunner.com">ftg@roadrunner.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;">
+No they won&#39;t.  They won&#39;t know anything about the distinction between<br>
+installing via RPM or via tarball.  They&#39;ll look in rpmdrake for Eclipse<br>
+initially, install it from there, and then use the normal Eclipse<br>
+mechanism to install plugins.  They&#39;ll do this because we tell them to<br>
+use rpmdrake to look for software, and they&#39;ll do the plugins the way<br>
+they&#39;re used to or the way the Eclipse docs tell them to.<br></blockquote></div><br>I don&#39;t agree with you at that point. I always take the tarball from <a href="http://eclipse.org">eclipse.org</a> (for eclipse) or <a href="http://netbeans.org">netbeans.org</a> (for netbeans) instead of the one&#39;s of repository provided by the distro.<br>
+The reason is quite simple, the one&#39;s mentioned above are newer than the one&#39;s in the repos (often, not always but everywhere i looked for it, it was so)<br><br>But there may be people who will first look in rpmdrake or urpmi that&#39;s right, but not everybody.<br>
+-- <br>Mit freundlichen Grüßen<br><br>Greetings<br><br>Daniel Kreuter<br><br><br><br>
diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-dev/attachments/20110113/c13239b9/attachment-0001.asc b/zarb-ml/mageia-dev/attachments/20110113/c13239b9/attachment-0001.asc
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+++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-dev/attachments/20110113/c13239b9/attachment-0001.asc
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diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-dev/attachments/20110113/cb11c63b/attachment-0001.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-dev/attachments/20110113/cb11c63b/attachment-0001.html
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--- /dev/null
+++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-dev/attachments/20110113/cb11c63b/attachment-0001.html
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+<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, Jan 13, 2011 at 12:49 PM, Frank Griffin <span dir="ltr">&lt;<a href="mailto:ftg@roadrunner.com">ftg@roadrunner.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">
+
+
+
+
+
+<div bgcolor="#ffffff" text="#000000">
+Daniel Kreuter wrote:
+<blockquote type="cite"><br>
+I don&#39;t agree with you at that point. I always take the tarball from <a href="http://eclipse.org" target="_blank">eclipse.org</a> (for
+eclipse) or <a href="http://netbeans.org" target="_blank">netbeans.org</a>
+(for netbeans) instead of the one&#39;s of repository provided by the
+distro.<br>
+The reason is quite simple, the one&#39;s mentioned above are newer than
+the one&#39;s in the repos (often, not always but everywhere i looked for
+it, it was so)<br>
+ <br>
+But there may be people who will first look in rpmdrake or urpmi that&#39;s
+right, but not everybody.<br>
+</blockquote>
+<br>
+Well, I didn&#39;t say *everybody*, I was referring to newer users who
+might actually do what we tell them to :-)<br>
+<br>
+The problem is that there is a very high probability that anyone who
+installs from an RPM will then install plugins directly.  Given that, I
+would question even packaging the base product as an RPM.<br>
+<br></div></blockquote></div>I agree with you. I think it&#39;s better to build just the basic ide with it&#39;s plugins and let the user install the rest via the Eclipse Marketplace (like Subclipse e.g.).<div>But we should consider that some of the plugins will have dependencies which won&#39;t be installed via the Marketplace like javaHL which is needed by Subclipse.<br clear="all">
+<br>-- <br>Mit freundlichen Grüßen<br><br>Greetings<br><br>Daniel Kreuter<br><br><br><br>
+</div>
diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-dev/attachments/20110113/cb11c63b/attachment.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-dev/attachments/20110113/cb11c63b/attachment.html
new file mode 100644
index 000000000..39918b990
--- /dev/null
+++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-dev/attachments/20110113/cb11c63b/attachment.html
@@ -0,0 +1,30 @@
+<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, Jan 13, 2011 at 12:49 PM, Frank Griffin <span dir="ltr">&lt;<a href="mailto:ftg@roadrunner.com">ftg@roadrunner.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">
+
+
+
+
+
+<div bgcolor="#ffffff" text="#000000">
+Daniel Kreuter wrote:
+<blockquote type="cite"><br>
+I don&#39;t agree with you at that point. I always take the tarball from <a href="http://eclipse.org" target="_blank">eclipse.org</a> (for
+eclipse) or <a href="http://netbeans.org" target="_blank">netbeans.org</a>
+(for netbeans) instead of the one&#39;s of repository provided by the
+distro.<br>
+The reason is quite simple, the one&#39;s mentioned above are newer than
+the one&#39;s in the repos (often, not always but everywhere i looked for
+it, it was so)<br>
+ <br>
+But there may be people who will first look in rpmdrake or urpmi that&#39;s
+right, but not everybody.<br>
+</blockquote>
+<br>
+Well, I didn&#39;t say *everybody*, I was referring to newer users who
+might actually do what we tell them to :-)<br>
+<br>
+The problem is that there is a very high probability that anyone who
+installs from an RPM will then install plugins directly.  Given that, I
+would question even packaging the base product as an RPM.<br>
+<br></div></blockquote></div>I agree with you. I think it&#39;s better to build just the basic ide with it&#39;s plugins and let the user install the rest via the Eclipse Marketplace (like Subclipse e.g.).<div>But we should consider that some of the plugins will have dependencies which won&#39;t be installed via the Marketplace like javaHL which is needed by Subclipse.<br clear="all">
+<br>-- <br>Mit freundlichen Grüßen<br><br>Greetings<br><br>Daniel Kreuter<br><br><br><br>
+</div>
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