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diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-dev/20110327/003735.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-dev/20110327/003735.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..2884a061a --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-dev/20110327/003735.html @@ -0,0 +1,156 @@ +<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 3.2//EN"> +<HTML> + <HEAD> + <TITLE> [Mageia-dev] Non-free firmwares in installer + </TITLE> + <LINK REL="Index" HREF="index.html" > + <LINK REL="made" HREF="mailto:mageia-dev%40mageia.org?Subject=Re%3A%20%5BMageia-dev%5D%20Non-free%20firmwares%20in%20installer&In-Reply-To=%3C4D8E77FD.8050305%40roadrunner.com%3E"> + <META NAME="robots" CONTENT="index,nofollow"> + <META http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=us-ascii"> + + <LINK REL="Next" HREF="003737.html"> + </HEAD> + <BODY BGCOLOR="#ffffff"> + <H1>[Mageia-dev] Non-free firmwares in installer</H1> + <B>Frank Griffin</B> + <A HREF="mailto:mageia-dev%40mageia.org?Subject=Re%3A%20%5BMageia-dev%5D%20Non-free%20firmwares%20in%20installer&In-Reply-To=%3C4D8E77FD.8050305%40roadrunner.com%3E" + TITLE="[Mageia-dev] Non-free firmwares in installer">ftg at roadrunner.com + </A><BR> + <I>Sun Mar 27 00:34:21 CET 2011</I> + <P><UL> + + <LI>Next message: <A HREF="003737.html">[Mageia-dev] Non-free firmwares in installer +</A></li> + <LI> <B>Messages sorted by:</B> + <a href="date.html#3735">[ date ]</a> + <a href="thread.html#3735">[ thread ]</a> + <a href="subject.html#3735">[ subject ]</a> + <a href="author.html#3735">[ author ]</a> + </LI> + </UL> + <HR> +<!--beginarticle--> +<PRE>On 03/26/2011 01:11 AM, andre999 wrote: +><i> Frank Griffin a écrit : +</I>>><i> +</I>><i> From what you say, there are not a lot of points of disagreement +</I>><i> between us, on this issue. +</I>><i> We both have contributed to open source for a long time, you +</I>><i> apparently mostly on developement/packaging, myself mostly +</I>><i> translating/ aide in forums, with some contributions to development. +</I>><i> (Currently an apprentice packager.) +</I>><i> +</I>><i> You find 2 isos a minor inconvenience, but in practice normally +</I>><i> install online, from cooker/cauldron. +</I> +Actually, what I wrote was that I hadn't used ISOs since I discovered +cooker. I used them before that for many years (since about MDV 7.2), +In fact, in the mkcd days, I used to burn all 9 of the 650-700MB CDs +needed to contain the full package set. + +><i> +</I>><i> Myself, I find a single DVD that contains everything I need to get a +</I>><i> fully working system (in terms of hardware/drivers) a major +</I>><i> convenience, and do not have the luxury of the bandwidth necessary to +</I>><i> install from the internet. +</I>><i> I don't know if you have ever installed from Mandriva's 3-cd set, but +</I>><i> juggling 3 cds on installing a package is a hassle that I very much +</I>><i> prefer to avoid. One iso is great. +</I> +Given the state of current technology, if you don't have the bandwidth +to do network installs, then you are understandably at the low end of +the marketing curve, and pretty much have to take what you can find. + +Don't get me wrong, I've been there. I've been an OS/2 enthusiast for +years (actually, decades now), and I know what it is to be on the short +end of the supply curve. And for about a year in 2003, the town I moved +to had no broadband, and I maintained my cooker tree via dialup (god +help us all). + +Through all this, my mindset was that I chose or had had imposed upon me +these restrictions. I bore my Windows friends no animus for the fact +that I had to jump through hoops to either find equivalent apps or run +theirs under emulation in order to interact with others in my office. I +did what I had to do in order to run the system I wanted to run, and I +assure you that juggling a few disks during the install would have been +the least of my worries. + +For you to complain that because you have minimal network access, the +rest of the Mageia community should bend over backwards to avoid your +having to swap a few CDs during install is a pretty hollow argument, in +my opinion. + + +><i> +</I>><i> As well, I appreciate very much the ability to do a complete, fully +</I>><i> working reinstall without internet access. +</I>><i> (To facilitate this, I keep packages installed from sources other than +</I>><i> the DVD in a separate partition.) +</I>><i> +</I>><i> The single DVD is not only useful for myself. It is handy to promote +</I>><i> Linux as well. Unfortunately, with missing firmware and drivers, the +</I>><i> DVD will not fully work on many systems. And new users prefer a +</I>><i> _single_ iso that just works. Having to juggle isos is a deterant. +</I> +I'm sorry, but I don't accept this argument. It hasn't been so long +since Windows installed from multiple floppies. I would accept that a +new user who had been given the impression that the single DVD was all +he needed would be annoyed if he found that the resulting system didn't +work, but if it is shoved in the user's face that the second ISO is +needed, I very much doubt that even a new user would try to install from +the one ISO and complain about it. + +><i> +</I>><i> On the question of space on the DVD, you must admit that all the +</I>><i> (non-free) firmware and drivers (not already included) would not take +</I>><i> an enormous amount of space. +</I> +And therefore, downloading an ISO for them could be done under dialup, +or even two tin cans and a string. + + +><i> Note that on the Mandriva 2010.2 DVD, for example, the 2 biggest games +</I>><i> take about 100 M and 40 M repectively. +</I>><i> It is simply a matter of priorities. +</I> +This is a completely separate topic. I tried to avoid it, because every +time it surfaces in the cooker ML it results in a flame war between +countless parties all jockeying to get their favorite app on the single +DVD. If you want to jump into this, feel free, but not with me. I +don't care what is or isn't on the primary ISO. + +><i> +</I>><i> In sum, it is easy to understand your point of view, as you don't +</I>><i> (normally) use isos. +</I>><i> Please understand the point of view of those who do, particularly +</I>><i> those who have serious bandwidth restrictions. +</I> +I do understand your point of view, but I don't espouse it to the point +of saying that Mageia should trim its primary DVD or shuffle its +contents just to save people with limited bandwidth having to juggle a +few disks during an install. + + +</PRE> + + + +<!--endarticle--> + <HR> + <P><UL> + <!--threads--> + + <LI>Next message: <A HREF="003737.html">[Mageia-dev] Non-free firmwares in installer +</A></li> + <LI> <B>Messages sorted by:</B> + <a href="date.html#3735">[ date ]</a> + <a href="thread.html#3735">[ thread ]</a> + <a href="subject.html#3735">[ subject ]</a> + <a href="author.html#3735">[ author ]</a> + </LI> + </UL> + +<hr> +<a href="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-dev">More information about the Mageia-dev +mailing list</a><br> +</body></html> |