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diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-dev/20110305/003032.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-dev/20110305/003032.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..1bd3ea430 --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-dev/20110305/003032.html @@ -0,0 +1,308 @@ +<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 3.2//EN"> +<HTML> + <HEAD> + <TITLE> [Mageia-dev] Contributors using real name/working email? or not? or maybe? + </TITLE> + <LINK REL="Index" HREF="index.html" > + <LINK REL="made" HREF="mailto:mageia-dev%40mageia.org?Subject=Re%3A%20%5BMageia-dev%5D%20Contributors%20using%20real%20name/working%20email%3F%20or%0A%09not%3F%20or%20maybe%3F&In-Reply-To=%3C201103051141.25530.bgmilne%40staff.telkomsa.net%3E"> + <META NAME="robots" CONTENT="index,nofollow"> + <META http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=us-ascii"> + <LINK REL="Previous" HREF="003034.html"> + <LINK REL="Next" HREF="003039.html"> + </HEAD> + <BODY BGCOLOR="#ffffff"> + <H1>[Mageia-dev] Contributors using real name/working email? or not? or maybe?</H1> + <B>Buchan Milne</B> + <A HREF="mailto:mageia-dev%40mageia.org?Subject=Re%3A%20%5BMageia-dev%5D%20Contributors%20using%20real%20name/working%20email%3F%20or%0A%09not%3F%20or%20maybe%3F&In-Reply-To=%3C201103051141.25530.bgmilne%40staff.telkomsa.net%3E" + TITLE="[Mageia-dev] Contributors using real name/working email? or not? or maybe?">bgmilne at staff.telkomsa.net + </A><BR> + <I>Sat Mar 5 10:41:24 CET 2011</I> + <P><UL> + <LI>Previous message: <A HREF="003034.html">[Mageia-dev] Alpha2 iso content +</A></li> + <LI>Next message: <A HREF="003039.html">[Mageia-dev] Contributors using real name/working email? or not? or maybe? +</A></li> + <LI> <B>Messages sorted by:</B> + <a href="date.html#3032">[ date ]</a> + <a href="thread.html#3032">[ thread ]</a> + <a href="subject.html#3032">[ subject ]</a> + <a href="author.html#3032">[ author ]</a> + </LI> + </UL> + <HR> +<!--beginarticle--> +<PRE>On Friday, 4 March 2011 19:58:31 Maarten Vanraes wrote: +><i> Op vrijdag 04 maart 2011 05:50:23 schreef Anssi Hannula: +</I>><i> > On 04.03.2011 00:51, Maarten Vanraes wrote: +</I>><i> > > Op donderdag 03 maart 2011 22:58:16 schreef nicolas vigier: +</I>><i> > >> On Thu, 03 Mar 2011, Maarten Vanraes wrote: +</I>><i> > >>> Op donderdag 03 maart 2011 22:31:10 schreef Romain d'Alverny: +</I>><i> > >>>> On Thu, Mar 3, 2011 at 21:54, Frank Griffin <<A HREF="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-dev">ftg at roadrunner.com</A>> +</I>wrote: +><i> > >>>>> Maarten Vanraes wrote: +</I>><i> > >>>>>> C. how about we make <packagename>@packages.mageia.org, which +</I>><i> > >>>>>> could use the maintainers database to forward the email to +</I>><i> > >>>>>> maintainers (in case of more) (this could also be a packagegroup. +</I>><i> > >>>>>> eg: <A HREF="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-dev">firefox at packages.mageia.org</A> could refer to maintainers of +</I>><i> > >>>>>> firefox, xulrunner, etc...) (this option might just be too +</I>><i> > >>>>>> complex) +</I>><i> > >>>>> +</I>><i> > >>>>> That is an elegant and excellent idea. +</I>><i> > >>>> +</I>><i> > >>>> Elegant, but as in a changelog, that means the email does not +</I>><i> > >>>> match/identify/link to the _person_ taking the step of actually +</I>><i> > >>>> committing/releasing the change, but the team in charge of managing +</I>><i> > >>>> the package. Is that wanted? +</I>><i> > >>>> +</I>><i> > >>>> Romain +</I>><i> > >>> +</I>><i> > >>> it depends, the nickname could still be kept; and we were talking +</I>><i> > >>> about having multiple maintainers in the future? +</I>><i> > >> +</I>><i> > >> Except that changelog is not for listing maintainers, but the persons +</I>><i> > >> who did some changes. +</I>><i> > > +</I>><i> > > but changelog is for committing, not submitting? isn't this a totally +</I>><i> > > different thing? +</I>><i> > +</I>><i> > I don't understand what you mean. +</I>><i> > +</I>><i> > Changelog is a log of changes made to the package. +</I>><i> +</I>><i> afaik changelog is compiled from svn commit messages? i don't really +</I>><i> understand how the submit could have an effect on changelog? +</I> +Let's go back to the original request: + +><i> >>> Could we use the submitter name in the mail adress like it's done at +</I>><i> >>> mdv? It helps filter out the packages mail. +</I>><i> >> +</I>><i> >> ie ? +</I>><i> >> +</I>><i> > >From is "Mageia Team" as is the Packager tag of the rpm while we could +</I>><i> > +</I>><i> > use full name from ldap +</I>><i> +</I>><i> Indeed. +</I>><i> Like back in MDV +</I>><i> . +</I>><i> Also, we should use it in changelogs (but with real packager email) +</I>><i> so that we got nicer changelogs. +</I>><i> Here it's impossible for end user joe to contact the packager in case +</I>><i> of problem since there're no emails in changelog +</I>><i> +</I>><i> eg: compare MDV: +</I>><i> +</I>><i> => From Funda Wang <<A HREF="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-dev">devel at mandriva.com</A>> +</I>><i> => Funda Wang <<A HREF="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-dev">fwang at mandriva.org</A>> 1:1.3.14-2mdv2011.0: +</I>><i> +</I>><i> With MGA: +</I>><i> +</I>><i> => From Mageia Team <<A HREF="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-dev">buildsystem-daemon at mageia.org</A>> +</I>><i> => tux99 <tux99> 0.12.3-2.mga1: +</I>><i> +</I>><i> We should use the following instead +</I>><i> +</I>><i> => From Joe Clinton <<A HREF="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-dev">buildsystem-daemon at mageia.org</A>> +</I>><i> => Joe Clinton <<A HREF="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-dev">joec at mageia.org</A>> 0.12.3-2.mga1: +</I> +So, 'changelog' refers no just to the entries in the %changelog section of the +spec file, but also the %packager tag in the package, and the headers in the +mail. + +Here are some examples for comparison: + +<A HREF="http://lists.mandriva.com/changelog/2011-03/msg00100.php">http://lists.mandriva.com/changelog/2011-03/msg00100.php</A> +(note, From tag oringally has: +From: Colin Guthrie <<A HREF="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-dev">devel at mandriva.com</A>> +changelog entry originally has Colin's and Anssi's Mandriva addresses) + +vs +<A HREF="https://ml.mageia.org/wwsympa-wrapper.fcgi/arc/changelog/2011-03/msg00179.html">https://ml.mageia.org/wwsympa-wrapper.fcgi/arc/changelog/2011-03/msg00179.html</A> + +So, the issues are: + +1)What to use in the From tag in the mail to the changelog list. + +Mandriva: From: Full Name <<A HREF="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-dev">devel at mandriva...</A>> +Mageia: From: Mageia Team <<A HREF="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-dev">buildsystem-daemon at mageia....</A>> + +IMHO, it is beneficial to have the "name" of the submitter of the package in +the From tag, you can easily, from just looking at the list of mails in a +folder, see what packages were updated, and if they are packages you maintain, +who submitted them, without even having to open the mail. Having a generic +static text here is of no benefit ... + +What we use as the "name" of the user is worth discussing, but I don't see any +reason to limit it to being the username. + +I don't see a need to have the email address in the From be dedicated to the +packager/submitter. + +Proposal 1.1: +From: $user{cn} <<A HREF="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-dev">packages at mageia.org</A>> +e.g. +From: Buchan Milne <<A HREF="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-dev">packages at mageia.org</A>> + +If we want to rather try and build teams who work on specific groups of +packages, it may be better to have use: + +Proposal 1.2: +From: $user{cn} <%<A HREF="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-dev">name at packages.mageia.org</A>> +e.g. +From: Buchan Milne <<A HREF="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-dev">openldap at packages.mageia.org</A>> + +and have per-package aliases tied to the maintainer database. This may make it +easier to assign bugs in bugzilla, without having to re-assign bugs whenever +someone joins/leaves/changes roles. + +Additionally, assuming Reply-To is not set, replying to the changelog mail +would get you to all the contributors who maintain the package. With Reply-To +set, Reply-All would get you to a mailing list, as well as the alias. In my +case, I filter mail based on mailing list tags, so this would mean mails about +my packages would not hit the mailing list folder, but could hit a different +folder with a better priority. + +It might be a bit overkill in some situations (e.g. kde-i18n- +<A HREF="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-dev">af at packages.mageia.org</A>), but maybe we could look up the maintainer team from +the package name, and that could be <A HREF="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-dev">i18n-af at mageia.org</A> or +<A HREF="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-dev">kde at packages.mageia.org.</A> + +But, if we want to focus on team work rather than individuals, maybe: +Proposal 1.3 +From: Mageia %name team <<A HREF="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-dev">openldap at packages.mageia.org</A>> +e.g. +From: Mageia openldap team <<A HREF="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-dev">openldap at packages.mageia.org</A>> + +Again, we could possible look up the maintainer team name, e.g. "Mageia +Afrikaans localisation team" or "Mageia KDE team" using the example above, or +"Mageia Server team" or "Mageia LDAP team" or similar in this example: +From: Mageia %name{cn} <%name{mail}> + +But, this loses some of the easy-overview-by-folder-view. + +Finally, there is always the totally personal, spam-attracting option: +Proposal 1.4 +From: $user{cn} <$user{mail}> +e.g. +From: Buchan Milne <<A HREF="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-dev">bgmilne at xxx</A>> + +Now, which email address this is is another issue. If we are going to offer +all contributors (anyone who can commit to svn), then we can use a Mageia +alias everywhere by default, and have these as aliases to the contributor's +personal email address. However, if a contributor receives a direct mail to +their contributor address, do they expect to be able to reply from that +address? E.g., our work mail system does sender validation, so I can only send +from an address that is an alias on the account which I authenticate as. For +Mandriva, I ssh port forward into the cluster to send mail from my Mandriva +alias ... + +If users have to reply from their personal address, it defeats the +anonymity/privacy goal. + + +My preference: 1.2 or 1.3 + +2)What to use in the %packager tag. + +All the proposals above apply, but let's refer to them as 2.1 through 2.4. + +My preference: 1.2 or 1.4 + +3)What to use in the %changelog section of the spec file + +Mandriva: +Full Name <<A HREF="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-dev">usermail at mandriva....</A>> %version-%release: ++ Revision: XXX + +Mageia: +uid <uid> %version-%release: ++ Revision: XXX + +My preference would be that people who are happy to disclose their real names +be able to have the full name expanded in the changelog entries, however there +isn't necessarily a requirement to keep a valid email address. + +Proposal 3.1: +$user{cn} <$user{uid}> %version-%release +e.g. +Buchan Milne <buchan> 3.5.7-1mga + +Porposal 3.2: +$user{cn} <$user{mail}> %version-%release +e.g. +Buchan Milne <<A HREF="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-dev">bgmilne at mageia.</A>> + + +4)LDAP implications + +4.1)As far as I know, we don't currently use givenName or sn outside +<A HREF="https://identity.mageia.org">https://identity.mageia.org</A> at all at present. Within +<A HREF="https://identity.mageia.org,">https://identity.mageia.org,</A> the givenName and sn are visible to the user, and +to Account Admins, and possibily Group Admins. All emails sent to the user +currently use cn, but it may be more personal to use "givenName sn" instead? + +Bugzilla uses cn and mail +Forum should use cn and mail + +4.2)I am not prepared to do work to remove sn and givenName, if you don't want +users to have to supply values that will never be exposed, but personalise +account management communication, submit a patch, or fork. + +Users can edit cn immediately on account creation anyway, and always have been +able to. + +4.3)I don't see the utility of having 2 email addresses at present, while we +don't have aliases. If we are going to have Mageia aliases, let's discuss that +first, there are more issues than just users who want to use two different +email addresses for privacy reasons. + +However, if we do have aliases, then we will most likely introduce a +mailForwardingAddress attribute. This would then contain the real email +address, mail would contain the Mageia address for contributors, and mail to +the alias would be forwarded to the mailAlternateAddress + +Please indicate if this would be sufficient, or if you think non-contributor +users would require the ability to have a different email address (for +identity account management, e.g. password recovery, only). Note that non- +contributors mails would be used by bugzilla and sympa. But they are free to +use a Mageia-specific account/address, no one has ever required it to be a +personal address that goes to your work server, or personally identifies you. + + +I don't want to waste any more time on this, and I will not make any changes +to CatDap for this unless there is consensus on a specification on which I can +base (manual for now) testing. + +Regards, +Buchan +</PRE> + + + + + + + + + +<!--endarticle--> + <HR> + <P><UL> + <!--threads--> + <LI>Previous message: <A HREF="003034.html">[Mageia-dev] Alpha2 iso content +</A></li> + <LI>Next message: <A HREF="003039.html">[Mageia-dev] Contributors using real name/working email? or not? or maybe? +</A></li> + <LI> <B>Messages sorted by:</B> + <a href="date.html#3032">[ date ]</a> + <a href="thread.html#3032">[ thread ]</a> + <a href="subject.html#3032">[ subject ]</a> + <a href="author.html#3032">[ author ]</a> + </LI> + </UL> + +<hr> +<a href="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-dev">More information about the Mageia-dev +mailing list</a><br> +</body></html> |