[Mageia-discuss] Thank you - Merci - Danke - Gracias - Grazie - Obrigado - спасибо

Wed Sep 22 18:11:25 CEST 2010

Le 2010-09-22 10:41, Michael Scherer a écrit :
+> Le mardi 21 septembre 2010 à 16:53 -0400, Marc Paré a écrit :
+>
+>> Would it make sense to also have a section for "mageia" domain owners to
+>> track domain owners who are willing to cooperate? You will eventually
+>> have to do this anyway. I would also consider this also a type of offer
+>> of cooperation and help.
+>
+> Personally, I think we should not collect all domain names to give them
+> to the association :
+
+The offer was to pass on the domain if the Mageia project wanted to have 
+it. It adds flexibility
+
+>
+> 1) each domain name will need admin time. Either to manage ( ie, set up
+> vhost, setup the zone, add a entry to the zone etc ), or to renew. While
+> renewing 1 domain name every year is easy, renewing 10 or 20 on 10 to 20
+> different resellers, for different prices and so on will be quite
+> annoying.
+
+When passing off a domain, the reseller is transferred. You then 
+consolidate all under on reseller. I do this all the time.
+
+>
+> 2) this will also generate work for people in charge of comptability,
+> and we know that people doing the work of a CFO are a scarce ressources
+> ( CFO may not be the proper word, but I didn't found better ).
+
+You set a pointer to the main site and there is no need to use the other 
+domain names if you do not wish.
+
+>
+> 3) too much domain name will cost money. I think that what ever we have,
+> money would likely better used everywhere than domain name.
+
+Yes you are right. Which is why some of us registered and are willing to 
+offer these back to the Mageia project if it wishes. If the Mageia 
+project wishes these, then the project will have to build this into its 
+business model. The same would have applied if the Mageia project had 
+decided from the outset to purchase all of the necessary TLD'S. The 
+project would've had to budget this into its working 
+organizational/financial model.
+
+>
+>
+> Next it depend on what we do for the domain, but basically, either it is
+> use for http, or for mail.
+
+Mostly for http redirect at first. It depends on the needs.
+
+>
+> If we use for http :
+>
+> 4) too much domain will be a pain from a ssl point of view. If we start
+> to need ssl for a site, and there is 10 Vhost for it, we will just have
+> 10 time the work to renew certificates.
+
+Not applicable if you redirect the domains. You would then only have to 
+establish certificates for those domains that you intend to use.
+
+>
+> 5) too much domain will also requires more work for simple http, since
+> we will have lots of them.
+
+Not applicable if you set a pointer. This will also depend on the amount 
+of website developers help who have signed up.
+
+>
+> 6) too much different url will just mean more confusion. I may also fear
+> this could be seen by major search engine as unethic SEO, and thus be
+> punished ( since link farm is a commonly used technic to try to hijack
+> some keywords ). But Google, Yahoo and Bing systems are closed source,
+> so I do not know.
+
+This is not unethic as all business on the internet do this as common 
+practice. Try to type in URL's for any major corporation, or Yahoo!, 
+Google, Bing etc.
+
+>
+> If we use for mail :
+>
+> 7) too much domain will simply mean more spam. If we offer multiple
+> email ( like "example at mageia.org, and .de, and .fr and .cn, and so on ),
+> email will simply appear in more list, and therefore be more spammed.
+
+Domains do not have to be activated for mail. If a domain is not 
+activated for mail service then the mail bounces back to the sender. 
+This is done all of the time.
+
+>
+> 8) too much domain will simply mean more work. Again, if we use every
+> domain for mail be it a multi domain alias, or worst, let the choice, we
+> will need to take this in account in lots of place in the information
+> system, and this will mean more work, more complexity, more fragility.
+
+You have already covered these points up above. #8 is not a new point.
+
+>
+> 9) and of course, too much domain name, like for websites will mean more
+> confusion.
+
+It means less confusion. mageia.org will lead to main site; mageia.ca 
+does lead to main site; magiea.nl would lead to main site; mageia.net 
+would lead to main site; mageia.info would lead to main site ... How 
+would this be confusing?
+
+>
+> And finally, as I said before, we had a hard time finding a name because
+> because all the good one have been already used ( or trademarked ).
+> While people do not frivolously trademark name ( too costly ), there is
+> lots of domain name that are taken and finally unused. So by acting like
+> the others, we are simply causing trouble to others internet users. A
+> web site about magic trick could perfectly use mageia.tld without
+> causing trouble to us. A restaurant, anything could also do it.
+
+By Trademarking and adopting/registering the domain names attached to 
+your trademark you are actually doing what would be expected of a good 
+solid business model that Banks would like to see for example, load 
+applications as well as for grants where government would see a well 
+organized domain tree and trademarked name.
+
+By doing business the way that you advocate, you actually lower the 
+fidelity that one would assume of a serious group.
+
+>
+> So
+>
+> 10) by registering every possible variation, we are acting selfishly
+> toward others netizens.
+
+You have already covered these points up above with #9. #10 is not a new 
+point.
+
+>
+>
+> So I do not really see what having lots of domain name would bring.
+> Maybe I do not see because I am root on the main dns server, maybe
+> because I already have my own domain name since so long time, I do not
+> know.
+
+I am not root on a DNS server but have owned domain names for a while 
+like you have and hold a different view than yours.
+
+>
+> The only answer I got was about security. But seriously, security of
+> what ? Protecting from people doing phishing ? Bank already fail at
+> this, and you think we can ?
+
+Who mentioned security? This is all about flexibility.
+
+>
+> Protecting from people misusing the name ? there is trademark laws and
+> various others way ( not to mention that I do not see much to misuse at
+> the moment ).
+
+You will be of a different opinion once your trademark application has 
+been approved.
+
+>
+> And frankly, there is too much variation beside top level domain to be
+> exhaustive to protect anything.
+
+It is not a matter of registering ALL permutations. It is a matter of 
+having at one's disposal more of the mageia.XXX domains if at all 
+possible. This will give you more web presence for name branding purposes.
+
+>
+>
+> So for the 10 reasons I gave, and because I see almost no benefit, I
+> think the association shouldn't manage so much domains. I cannot prevent
+> people from renting them, but my 2 last point ( 9 and 10 ) still apply,
+> IMHO.
+
+You have 8 points in your list and my reasoning to go along with these 8.
+
+Discussions and exchange of ideas are always a healthy act.
+
+Cheers
+
+Marc
+
+
+