[Mageia-dev] 3.0 release - some initial notes; failure

Tue Jan 8 12:41:29 CET 2013

Hi Liam,
+
+let me reply to your E-mail - not necessarily disagreeing.
+
+On Mon, 07 Jan 2013 02:46:39 -0500
+Liam R E Quin <liam at holoweb.net> wrote:
+
+> Tried installing 3.0 beta over a Mandriva Cooker system today.
+> Mageia-3-beta1-x86_64-DVD.iso
+
+Can Mandriva Cooker be upgraded to Mageia 3? I don't think it can be (due to
+Mandriva's switch to rpm5). Or do you mean you reformatted the relevant
+partitions and installed a new system?
+
+> 
+> Some notes. Mostly about problems because I never got to see a working
+> system, so the tone is probably more negative than I'd like.
+> 
+
+No problem with that for me - bring on the negativity, I say, because that will
+help us improve the program. Also Lawrence Lessig's anecdote which I quoted at:
+
+http://teachingopensource.org/index.php/How_to_start_contributing_to_or_using_Open_Source_Software#Some_Mental_Preparation
+
+(short URL - http://xrl.us/biknkf ).
+
+> 
+> On boot, there was a long delay followed by "Loading program" and a
+> progress bar appearing and disappearing again almost before I had time
+> to read the message. This didn't seem optimal.
+
+I see. What are your system's specifications? I think I usually install from a
+CD (just to have a working system) and then install more packages using urpmi. I
+am downloading the DVD .iso now and will try it in a VirtualBox VM later to see
+if I can reproduce any problems.
+
+> 
+> Choice of keyboard - there was a link to wikipedia in the Help text, but
+> it gave me an error that there was no network. There are two entries for
+> US Keyboard with no obvious reason, and a third for US International
+> (which I chose since I'm not in the US :-)) 
+
+Sounds like a bug or at least a problem in the installer. Can you file a bug
+for it on https://bugs.mageia.org/ ?
+
+> 
+> I have 2 disk drives. the installer wanted to use the spare space on my
+> Windows drive, when the other drive already had Linux. Yes, I could
+> choose from the drop-down, but it wasn't clear that I was choosing where
+> to put Mageia. Suggest add,
+> Multiple disk drives found. Choose which one you want to use for the
+> main Mageia system.
+
+Sounds like a good enhancement.
+
+> 
+> The disk was formatted. That was actually what I wanted, in this case,
+> but please add a warning that data will be lost - most humans on the
+> planet won't know that.
+
+Yes, true. Of course, you cannot expect your users to read:
+
+http://www.joelonsoftware.com/uibook/chapters/fog0000000062.html
+
+Or like my Technion lecturer once noted in one of the first talks in our
+Computer Graphics course, which taught us about designing for usability (from
+the P.O.V. of this book -
+http://www.shlomifish.org/philosophy/books-recommends/#design_of_everyday_things
+) a typical session can go like that:
+
+User: delete "My_most_important_work.doc"
+Computer: are you sure? [Yes] [No]
+User: Yes!
+Computer "My_most_important_work.doc" deleted.
+User: damn!
+
+But I approve of issuing a warning before that, or somehow preventing this
+from happening.
+ 
+> 
+> There's no indication of how long the formatting will take, or how much
+> has been done. I'll leave it running for an hour or two (it's a 250G
+> SATA hard drive) and see if it finishes, or maybe it crashed.
+> Please add a note that this may take a long time, preferably with an
+> OK/Cancel/Skip since (1) it wasn't needed here, and (2) users may well
+> give it a minute or so and then move on to the next Linux distribution
+> on the magazine, saying "Mageia hung my computer, it's crap."
+> 
+> Suggest progress bar or at least some quotes from Moliére.
+
+Heh. Well, formatting normally did not take too long for me, at least not in
+its fast formatting mode. But maybe a progress bar will be doable.
+
+> 
+> Note: eventually the bad block scan started giving a progress percentage
+> on another virtual terminal, but most users won't find that, of course,
+> even if they wait half an hour or more for it to begin.
+
+Oh, bad block scan. :-(. It should be displayed in the graphical installer.
+
+> 
+> I'm assuming the graphics and ugly font are not final. If they are, the
+> pink stripes look like an error. Maybe caused by running my monitor
+> (1920x1200/"deep colour") in 800x600 16-bit mode.
+
+I'll see if it happens to me in the installer.
+
+> 
+> The long list of packages being installed - would be nicer to show the
+> name of the current package, and its description, and more slowly to
+> show a more detailed description of just one program.
+
+By default the installer does not display the names of the packages installed I
+think - just a progress bar.
+
+> 
+> If there was a clear and obvious option to choose the LCD's native
+> resolution, a font like Matthew Carter's Bitstream Charter Italic would
+> look more sophisticated and also get more information on a line.
+> 
+
+Is it an open font.
+
+> Choosing a desktop - help said "broken link"
+> 
+
+Shouldn't the help be included inside the installer's media.
+
+> Choosing a desktop - please add versions, not just KDE, GNOME, Other.
+> 
+
+I'm not sure versions are a good idea because they may be confusing. I'm also
+not sure many users who start with Linux will understand the difference between
+KDE, GNOME or whatever, so maybe we should pick one or the other by default.
+
+> Also, I might want both KDE and GNOME installed, so I don't want to
+> choose just one and not the other. If I'll get a chance to install more
+> desktops later in the installer, please say so more clearly, not buried
+> in help (once the link to help is fixed)...
+
+Yes.
+
+> 
+> The installer seems much slower than it used to be, but maybe that's
+> changes in rpm? Three hours to install packages is a long time. Although
+> having said that, maybe the estimates were just wrong.
+
+How strange. I was able to install Mageia 2 in a VM (from the Dual CD though)
+in a few minutes.
+
+> 
+> At the end, several hours later, the DVD is ejected and the system tries
+> to reboot...
+> 
+> PANIC cannot mount proc on /proc! Compile the kernel with
+> CONFIG_PROC_FS!
+> 
+> Hmm. Well, I saw something go by about this on the mailing list so maybe
+> I can fix it without another 7-hour download of the DVD image.
+> 
+> Overall, though, the installer needs a huge injection of "slickness".
+> It's_almost_ there, but in graphic design "almost" doesn't get you a
+> cigar.
+
+That's true. By the way “GUI Design" is not graphic design. You can design good
+GUI without being a competent graphics designer. Designing web sites or Web
+UI with their stylish look and everything should look different than every
+other site, is a different issue, and from my experience, some web designs tend
+to be considered outdated, and some users (though different ones each time) will
+complain that they don't like your style. You cannot please all the people all
+the time.
+
+Regards,
+
+	Shlomi Fish
+
+> 
+> Liam
+> 
+> 
+> 
+
+
+
+-- 
+-----------------------------------------------------------------
+Shlomi Fish       http://www.shlomifish.org/
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