[Mageia-dev] [RFC] prefer dma rather than postfix in prefer.vendor.list for msec mga1 -> mga2 upgrade

Thu Nov 10 10:48:34 CET 2011

Michael Scherer a écrit :
+> Le mercredi 09 novembre 2011 à 22:41 +0200, Anssi Hannula a écrit :
+>    
+>> On 09.11.2011 22:34, Florian Hubold wrote:
+>>      
+>>> Am 09.11.2011 20:48, schrieb Michael Scherer:
+>>>        
+>>>> Le mercredi 09 novembre 2011 à 19:38 +0100, Florian Hubold a écrit :
+>>>>          
+>>>>> Hi there,
+>>>>>
+>>>>> as Anssi made me aware msec currently has a Requires on
+>>>>> sendmail-command for cauldron, this was the outcome of the
+>>>>> last discussion about msec / MTA.
+>>>>> However, currently in /etc/urpmi/prefer.vendor.list postfix
+>>>>> is preferred as sendmail-command and mail-server.
+>>>>>
+>>>>> Anssi's vote and mine is to replace preference on postfix
+>>>>> with dma to ensure users get dma installed with the
+>>>>> upgrade from Mageia 1 ->   2 and not postfix which needs
+>>>>> configuration.
+>>>>>            
+>>>> What configuration ?
+>>>> AFAIK, Postfix work out of the box for the use case of msec/cron, mail
+>>>> sent to root are delivered to root mailbox, unless someone added a
+>>>> aliase.
+>>>>
+>>>>          
+>>>>>  From a quick look at dma, it behave the same ( ie, it take aliase from
+>>>>>            
+>>>> the same file, thus requiring the same configuration, or needing the
+>>>> same declaration of a smart host ).
+>>>>
+>>>> Wouldn't it be better to send everything to /var/log if no mta are
+>>>> found ?
+>>>> ( ie, do something like that :
+>>>> http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Features/NoMTA ). We have the proper
+>>>> version of cronie ( I hope ), so what prevent us ?
+>>>>
+>>>>          
+>>> msec already sends everything also to /var/log, which was disregarded
+>>> in last discussion because normal users don't look there and it
+>>> slowly adds up on diskspace.
+>>>        
+>> Normal users also do not read local mailboxes and the mailboxes slowly
+>> add up on diskspace.
+>>      
+> And log files can be rotated, unlike mailboxes. Maybe the log are not
+> rotated on the other hand, so that's a bug that could/should be fixed,
+> if that's the case.
+>    
+Since log files are rotated and compressed, it is a lot better to avoid 
+duplicating all that detail to mailboxes, where it is not compressed, 
+accumulates indefinitely if not removed by user action.
+(On my system log files have always been properly rotated.)
+
+> What we could do is either :
+> - install nothing by default
+> - install postfix/dma/whatever by a drakwizard if/when user give a email
+> for msec alert.
+>    
+
+I have tended to favour installing dma, as personally I like being 
+notified, but I'm beginning to think that we need another solution.
+> Maybe another solution would be to make msec smarter and not spew 100
+> lines per hours. I am all for msec but as I say often, this look like a
+> Homer Simpson invention.
+
+That I agree with totally.
+Summaries to the mailing list (like x packages updated, y removed, z 
+added), with references to log would be much better.
+The defaults for the standard level are a bit ridiculous also.  How many 
+users care about which applications listen on ports ?  (Which is usually 
+only Internet.)
+
+Maybe a better alternative (by default) would be to send a persistant 
+alert to the screen, which refers to the log file.  And maybe has a link 
+to view the detail in the log file.
+The current alert disappears automatically after a few seconds, so is 
+very easily missed.  (Especially since it runs at 4 in the morning, at 
+least on my system.)
+With a persistant alert, I wouldn't need email notification.
+(I'm not running a server.)
+
+It might be an idea for msec to store these alerts (of not more than a 
+few lines each) in a special file, until each is acknowledged.  Every 
+new alert appears in a window on the screen, with all unacknowledged 
+previous alerts.  The window stays there until closed.  Much like a 
+dedicated mailing list without headers, and very compact.  With the 
+detail going to the logs.
+The more I think about it, I would very much prefer this sort of default 
+solution.
+Just an idea :)
+>
+> WDYT ?
+>    
+-- 
+André
+
+