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diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/20111123/005921.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/20111123/005921.html
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+ <TITLE> [Mageia-discuss] mandriva rpms versus cpan versus ?
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+ <H1>[Mageia-discuss] mandriva rpms versus cpan versus ?</H1>
+ <B>Florian Hubold</B>
+ <A HREF="mailto:mageia-discuss%40mageia.org?Subject=Re%3A%20%5BMageia-discuss%5D%20mandriva%20rpms%20versus%20cpan%20versus%20%3F&In-Reply-To=%3C4ECC355B.9070103%40arcor.de%3E"
+ TITLE="[Mageia-discuss] mandriva rpms versus cpan versus ?">doktor5000 at arcor.de
+ </A><BR>
+ <I>Wed Nov 23 00:50:51 CET 2011</I>
+ <P><UL>
+
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+<!--beginarticle-->
+<PRE>Am 22.11.2011 12:35, schrieb bascule:
+&gt;<i> due to lack of research on my part i now find that there appear to be no
+</I>&gt;<i> mageia1 rpms for apache-gallery and libapache-mod-mp3, i'm sure i could use
+</I>&gt;<i> cpan but then i'm mixing source compiles with rpms, i've read of but never
+</I>&gt;<i> tried making rpms from cpan using various utils, are these reliable? what
+</I>&gt;<i> about mandriva rpms, which distro should i look to borrow from, any advice
+</I>&gt;<i> welcome!
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i> bascule
+</I>You can either report it at our bugzilla as a package request:
+<A HREF="https://bugs.mageia.org/enter_bug.cgi?product=Mageia&amp;format=guided">https://bugs.mageia.org/enter_bug.cgi?product=Mageia&amp;format=guided</A>
+Please select Component &quot;New RPM package request&quot;.
+Or, you can use the package _perl-CPANPLUS-Dist-Mageia_ to build
+Mageia RPM packages directly from CPAN modules, like so:
+
+ cpan2dist --format=CPANPLUS::Dist::Mageia Some::Random::Package
+
+</PRE>
+
+
+
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+ <TITLE> [Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.
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+ <H1>[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.</H1>
+ <B>Barry Jackson</B>
+ <A HREF="mailto:mageia-discuss%40mageia.org?Subject=Re%3A%20%5BMageia-discuss%5D%20Sun%20java%20updates%20must%20now%20be%20downloaded%20and%0A%20installed%20manually.&In-Reply-To=%3C4ECC3BF9.3090103%40zen.co.uk%3E"
+ TITLE="[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.">zen25000 at zen.co.uk
+ </A><BR>
+ <I>Wed Nov 23 01:19:05 CET 2011</I>
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+<!--beginarticle-->
+<PRE>On 19/11/11 17:27, Markus Ueberall wrote:
+
+&gt;<i> I wonder whether it is feasible to come up with a &quot;get-sun-java&quot; rpm
+</I>
+I'm already on it ;)
+
+</PRE>
+
+
+
+
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+ <H1>[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.</H1>
+ <B>Maarten Vanraes</B>
+ <A HREF="mailto:mageia-discuss%40mageia.org?Subject=Re%3A%20%5BMageia-discuss%5D%20Sun%20java%20updates%20must%20now%20be%20downloaded%20and%0A%09installed%20manually.&In-Reply-To=%3C201111230128.07408.alien%40rmail.be%3E"
+ TITLE="[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.">alien at rmail.be
+ </A><BR>
+ <I>Wed Nov 23 01:28:07 CET 2011</I>
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+<!--beginarticle-->
+<PRE>Op woensdag 23 november 2011 01:19:05 schreef Barry Jackson:
+&gt;<i> On 19/11/11 17:27, Markus Ueberall wrote:
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt; I wonder whether it is feasible to come up with a &quot;get-sun-java&quot; rpm
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i> I'm already on it ;)
+</I>
+will you be ready for release?
+</PRE>
+
+
+
+
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+ <H1>[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.</H1>
+ <B>D.Morgan</B>
+ <A HREF="mailto:mageia-discuss%40mageia.org?Subject=Re%3A%20%5BMageia-discuss%5D%20Sun%20java%20updates%20must%20now%20be%20downloaded%20and%0A%20installed%20manually.&In-Reply-To=%3CCAL%2BdqvB3RU7T77u6hrk-hu2FjxukB5ttvavLSr4u%2BMEXp%3Dq0cg%40mail.gmail.com%3E"
+ TITLE="[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.">dmorganec at gmail.com
+ </A><BR>
+ <I>Wed Nov 23 01:32:28 CET 2011</I>
+ <P><UL>
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+<PRE>On Sat, Nov 19, 2011 at 6:27 PM, Markus Ueberall
+&lt;<A HREF="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-discuss">Markus.Ueberall at gmail.com</A>&gt; wrote:
+&gt;<i> Am 18.11.2011 04:52, schrieb David W. Hodgins:
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i> Agreed. &#160;Just want to make sure that anyone who is using the
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i> sun java package from the repositories know that they must
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i> get the latest security updates directly from java.com, as
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i> the packages in the Mageia repositories are not being updated.
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i> Regards, Dave Hodgins
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i> Hi,
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i> I wonder whether it is feasible to come up with a &quot;get-sun-java&quot; rpm
+</I>&gt;<i> which uses the same mechanism as the get-skype rpm for those who
+</I>&gt;<i> need/prefer Oracle's implementation?
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i> Ad astra, Markus
+</I>
+Why ? openjdk is good enough to replace oracle java.
+and soonish we will have java7 too in mageia so i really don't see now
+the need of the closed source one.
+</PRE>
+
+
+
+
+
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+ <H1>[Mageia-discuss] mandriva rpms versus cpan versus ?</H1>
+ <B>bascule</B>
+ <A HREF="mailto:mageia-discuss%40mageia.org?Subject=Re%3A%20%5BMageia-discuss%5D%20mandriva%20rpms%20versus%20cpan%20versus%20%3F&In-Reply-To=%3C201111230630.31434.asura%40theexcession.co.uk%3E"
+ TITLE="[Mageia-discuss] mandriva rpms versus cpan versus ?">asura at theexcession.co.uk
+ </A><BR>
+ <I>Wed Nov 23 07:30:30 CET 2011</I>
+ <P><UL>
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+<!--beginarticle-->
+<PRE>On Tuesday 22 November 2011 23:50:51 Florian Hubold wrote:
+&gt;<i> You can either report it at our bugzilla as a package request:
+</I>&gt;<i> <A HREF="https://bugs.mageia.org/enter_bug.cgi?product=Mageia&amp;format=guided">https://bugs.mageia.org/enter_bug.cgi?product=Mageia&amp;format=guided</A>
+</I>&gt;<i> Please select Component &quot;New RPM package request&quot;.
+</I>&gt;<i> Or, you can use the package perl-CPANPLUS-Dist-Mageia to build
+</I>&gt;<i> Mageia RPM packages directly from CPAN modules, like so:
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i> cpan2dist --format=CPANPLUS::Dist::Mageia Some::Random::Package
+</I>
+thankyou, i shall try that and see how it goes
+
+bascule
+--
+'I'll tell you this!' shouted Rincewind. 'I'd rather trust me than history!
+Oh, shit, did I just say that?'
+(Interesting Times)
+</PRE>
+
+
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+ <H1>[Mageia-discuss] mandriva rpms versus cpan versus ?</H1>
+ <B>Sandro CAZZANIGA</B>
+ <A HREF="mailto:mageia-discuss%40mageia.org?Subject=Re%3A%20%5BMageia-discuss%5D%20mandriva%20rpms%20versus%20cpan%20versus%20%3F&In-Reply-To=%3CCAFLWM9TSxm_fB44gGvKP7FmGUcbgYvzj8PPDh0pEikJqr7z-Qg%40mail.gmail.com%3E"
+ TITLE="[Mageia-discuss] mandriva rpms versus cpan versus ?">cazzaniga.sandro at gmail.com
+ </A><BR>
+ <I>Wed Nov 23 07:33:08 CET 2011</I>
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+<PRE>2011/11/23 Florian Hubold &lt;<A HREF="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-discuss">doktor5000 at arcor.de</A>&gt;
+
+&gt;<i> Am 22.11.2011 12:35, schrieb bascule:
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt; due to lack of research on my part i now find that there appear to be no
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt; mageia1 rpms for apache-gallery and libapache-mod-mp3, i'm sure i could
+</I>&gt;<i> use
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt; cpan but then i'm mixing source compiles with rpms, i've read of but
+</I>&gt;<i> never
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt; tried making rpms from cpan using various utils, are these reliable? what
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt; about mandriva rpms, which distro should i look to borrow from, any
+</I>&gt;<i> advice
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt; welcome!
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt;
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt; bascule
+</I>&gt;<i> You can either report it at our bugzilla as a package request:
+</I>&gt;<i> <A HREF="https://bugs.mageia.org/enter_bug.cgi?product=Mageia&amp;format=guided">https://bugs.mageia.org/enter_bug.cgi?product=Mageia&amp;format=guided</A>
+</I>&gt;<i> Please select Component &quot;New RPM package request&quot;.
+</I>&gt;<i> Or, you can use the package _perl-CPANPLUS-Dist-Mageia_ to build
+</I>&gt;<i> Mageia RPM packages directly from CPAN modules, like so:
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i> cpan2dist --format=CPANPLUS::Dist::Mageia Some::Random::Package
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>Do not forget to make the rpm directory for this command, like that:
+
+$ cd your/rpm/directory
+$ mkdir BUILD BUILDROOT RPMS SOURCES SPECS SRPMS tmp
+
+:<i>)
+</I>-------------- next part --------------
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+ <TITLE> [Mageia-discuss] Fwd: [FOSDEM] Call for stands, devroom talks and lightning talks
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+ <LINK REL="Index" HREF="index.html" >
+ <LINK REL="made" HREF="mailto:mageia-discuss%40mageia.org?Subject=Re%3A%20%5BMageia-discuss%5D%20Fwd%3A%20%5BFOSDEM%5D%20Call%20for%20stands%2C%0A%20devroom%20talks%20and%20lightning%20talks&In-Reply-To=%3C4ECCA798.70301%40xs4all.nl%3E">
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+ <H1>[Mageia-discuss] Fwd: [FOSDEM] Call for stands, devroom talks and lightning talks</H1>
+ <B>Marja van Waes</B>
+ <A HREF="mailto:mageia-discuss%40mageia.org?Subject=Re%3A%20%5BMageia-discuss%5D%20Fwd%3A%20%5BFOSDEM%5D%20Call%20for%20stands%2C%0A%20devroom%20talks%20and%20lightning%20talks&In-Reply-To=%3C4ECCA798.70301%40xs4all.nl%3E"
+ TITLE="[Mageia-discuss] Fwd: [FOSDEM] Call for stands, devroom talks and lightning talks">marja11 at xs4all.nl
+ </A><BR>
+ <I>Wed Nov 23 08:58:16 CET 2011</I>
+ <P><UL>
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+<PRE>Op 22-11-11 09:52, Romain d'Alverny schreef:
+&gt;<i> Hi guys,
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i> FOSDEM is calling! (4-5 February, in Brussels, Belgium)
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i> - who would like to act there as a Mageia member? (booth, conference)
+</I>FOSDEM is for developers. So you need developers for the booth?
+If not, you can list me for it.
+
+
+</PRE>
+
+
+
+
+
+
+
+
+
+
+
+<!--endarticle-->
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+ <H1>[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.</H1>
+ <B>Alejandro L&#243;pez</B>
+ <A HREF="mailto:mageia-discuss%40mageia.org?Subject=Re%3A%20%5BMageia-discuss%5D%20Sun%20java%20updates%20must%20now%20be%20downloaded%20and%0A%20installed%20manually.&In-Reply-To=%3CCAHDxzReNAA%2BmQpMFYbA-STdB5%3DB6NFU33Q%3Dw6-9pamWqxnADGQ%40mail.gmail.com%3E"
+ TITLE="[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.">listas.apl at gmail.com
+ </A><BR>
+ <I>Wed Nov 23 09:22:03 CET 2011</I>
+ <P><UL>
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+<PRE>On Wed, Nov 23, 2011 at 1:32 AM, D.Morgan &lt;<A HREF="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-discuss">dmorganec at gmail.com</A>&gt; wrote:
+
+&gt;<i> On Sat, Nov 19, 2011 at 6:27 PM, Markus Ueberall
+</I>&gt;<i> &lt;<A HREF="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-discuss">Markus.Ueberall at gmail.com</A>&gt; wrote:
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt; Am 18.11.2011 04:52, schrieb David W. Hodgins:
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt;&gt; Agreed. Just want to make sure that anyone who is using the
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt;&gt; sun java package from the repositories know that they must
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt;&gt; get the latest security updates directly from java.com, as
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt;&gt; the packages in the Mageia repositories are not being updated.
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt;&gt;
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt;&gt; Regards, Dave Hodgins
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt;
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt; Hi,
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt;
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt; I wonder whether it is feasible to come up with a &quot;get-sun-java&quot; rpm
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt; which uses the same mechanism as the get-skype rpm for those who
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt; need/prefer Oracle's implementation?
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt;
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt; Ad astra, Markus
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i> Why ? openjdk is good enough to replace oracle java.
+</I>&gt;<i> and soonish we will have java7 too in mageia so i really don't see now
+</I>&gt;<i> the need of the closed source one.
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>
+
+Everything you said is true, but let me disagree with your question. Why
+not? Some users might prefer Oracle's java, while others might rather use
+OpenJDK. As long as there are volunteers for maintaining both packages, why
+shou;d it be one or the other? Why not providing both?
+
+
+Alejandro.
+-------------- next part --------------
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+ <H1>[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.</H1>
+ <B>Wolfgang Bornath</B>
+ <A HREF="mailto:mageia-discuss%40mageia.org?Subject=Re%3A%20%5BMageia-discuss%5D%20Sun%20java%20updates%20must%20now%20be%20downloaded%20and%0A%20installed%20manually.&In-Reply-To=%3CCA%2Bh4nj7AbkLYkgszzue6Q0LnXiZ27gC4E4rtOv0iUWs%3DdO89LA%40mail.gmail.com%3E"
+ TITLE="[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.">molch.b at googlemail.com
+ </A><BR>
+ <I>Wed Nov 23 09:32:35 CET 2011</I>
+ <P><UL>
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+<PRE>2011/11/23 Alejandro L&#243;pez &lt;<A HREF="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-discuss">listas.apl at gmail.com</A>&gt;:
+&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i> On Wed, Nov 23, 2011 at 1:32 AM, D.Morgan &lt;<A HREF="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-discuss">dmorganec at gmail.com</A>&gt; wrote:
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i> On Sat, Nov 19, 2011 at 6:27 PM, Markus Ueberall
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i> &lt;<A HREF="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-discuss">Markus.Ueberall at gmail.com</A>&gt; wrote:
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i> &gt; Am 18.11.2011 04:52, schrieb David W. Hodgins:
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i> &gt;&gt; Agreed. &#160;Just want to make sure that anyone who is using the
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i> &gt;&gt; sun java package from the repositories know that they must
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i> &gt;&gt; get the latest security updates directly from java.com, as
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i> &gt;&gt; the packages in the Mageia repositories are not being updated.
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i> &gt;&gt;
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i> &gt;&gt; Regards, Dave Hodgins
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i> &gt;
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i> &gt; Hi,
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i> &gt;
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i> &gt; I wonder whether it is feasible to come up with a &quot;get-sun-java&quot; rpm
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i> &gt; which uses the same mechanism as the get-skype rpm for those who
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i> &gt; need/prefer Oracle's implementation?
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i> &gt;
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i> &gt; Ad astra, Markus
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i> Why ? &#160;openjdk is good enough to replace oracle java.
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i> and soonish we will have java7 too in mageia so i really don't see now
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i> the need of the closed source one.
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i> Everything you said is true, but let me disagree with your question. Why
+</I>&gt;<i> not? Some users might prefer Oracle's java, while others might rather use
+</I>&gt;<i> OpenJDK. As long as there are volunteers for maintaining both packages, why
+</I>&gt;<i> shou;d it be one or the other? Why not providing both?
+</I>
+In addition to that I read postings in the forum about OpenJDK not
+being able to run certain scripts/apps which were written with/on
+Oracle's java. The same story as with Okular vs. Acrobat Reader. For
+some users the need for the closed source application is a reality.
+Whether this is enough to have a &quot;get-sun-java&quot; or not is another
+question, though.
+
+--
+wobo
+</PRE>
+
+
+<!--endarticle-->
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+ <H1>[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.</H1>
+ <B>Oliver Burger</B>
+ <A HREF="mailto:mageia-discuss%40mageia.org?Subject=Re%3A%20%5BMageia-discuss%5D%20Sun%20java%20updates%20must%20now%20be%20downloaded%20and%0A%09installed%20manually.&In-Reply-To=%3C1799207.EOXUreFL2o%40beteigeuze.oli-home%3E"
+ TITLE="[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.">oliver.bgr at googlemail.com
+ </A><BR>
+ <I>Wed Nov 23 09:33:21 CET 2011</I>
+ <P><UL>
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+<PRE>Am Mittwoch, 23. November 2011, 09:22:03 schrieb Alejandro L&#243;pez:
+&gt;<i> On Wed, Nov 23, 2011 at 1:32 AM, D.Morgan &lt;<A HREF="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-discuss">dmorganec at gmail.com</A>&gt; wrote:
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt; Why ? openjdk is good enough to replace oracle java.
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt; and soonish we will have java7 too in mageia so i really don't see now
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt; the need of the closed source one.
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i> Everything you said is true, but let me disagree with your question. Why
+</I>&gt;<i> not? Some users might prefer Oracle's java, while others might rather use
+</I>&gt;<i> OpenJDK. As long as there are volunteers for maintaining both packages, why
+</I>&gt;<i> shou;d it be one or the other? Why not providing both?
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>let me answer this from another perspective.
+
+Mageia is an OpenSource project. So it should be our main goal to promote
+OpenSource software.
+As there is a good alternative in OpenJDK, I don't really see a need for
+providing a proprietary solution.
+In addition, I personally see the revocation of the redistribution license by
+Oracle as an &quot;unfriendly act&quot; towards the wider OpenSource community.
+
+So why should we bother to promote Oracle Jave by creating a workarround in
+our packaging system, when they are clearly moving away from the OpenSource
+community?
+After all, developers who really need Oracle Java will find it quite easy to
+install it directly from the Oracle website.
+
+Oliver
+</PRE>
+
+
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+ <H1>[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.</H1>
+ <B>Thorsten van Lil</B>
+ <A HREF="mailto:mageia-discuss%40mageia.org?Subject=Re%3A%20%5BMageia-discuss%5D%20Sun%20java%20updates%20must%20now%20be%20downloaded%20and%0A%20installed%20manually.&In-Reply-To=%3C4ECCB538.8040906%40gmx.de%3E"
+ TITLE="[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.">tvl83 at gmx.de
+ </A><BR>
+ <I>Wed Nov 23 09:56:24 CET 2011</I>
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+<PRE>Am 23.11.2011 09:33, schrieb Oliver Burger:
+&gt;<i> Am Mittwoch, 23. November 2011, 09:22:03 schrieb Alejandro L&#243;pez:
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i> On Wed, Nov 23, 2011 at 1:32 AM, D.Morgan&lt;<A HREF="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-discuss">dmorganec at gmail.com</A>&gt; wrote:
+</I>&gt;&gt;&gt;<i> Why ? openjdk is good enough to replace oracle java.
+</I>&gt;&gt;&gt;<i> and soonish we will have java7 too in mageia so i really don't see now
+</I>&gt;&gt;&gt;<i> the need of the closed source one.
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i> Everything you said is true, but let me disagree with your question. Why
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i> not? Some users might prefer Oracle's java, while others might rather use
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i> OpenJDK. As long as there are volunteers for maintaining both packages, why
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i> shou;d it be one or the other? Why not providing both?
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i> let me answer this from another perspective.
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i> Mageia is an OpenSource project. So it should be our main goal to promote
+</I>&gt;<i> OpenSource software.
+</I>&gt;<i> So why should we bother to promote Oracle Jave by creating a workarround in
+</I>&gt;<i> our packaging system, when they are clearly moving away from the OpenSource
+</I>&gt;<i> community?
+</I>
+Because the users expect to have it in the repositories. It may be used
+against Mageia, if it is not in there (as for flash, proprietary
+drivers, ...).
+Where do we want to draw the line, as we did the same for skype?
+
+We propagate the repositories as one main advantage of Linux. Everything
+is in one trusted source. No more seeking and downloading somewhere in
+the web from several sites. Automated updates. How should the uninformed
+and lazy user understand, that we didn't provide at least a &quot;get-java&quot;
+package?
+
+Regards,
+Thorsten
+
+
+
+</PRE>
+
+
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+ <H1>[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.</H1>
+ <B>Oliver Burger</B>
+ <A HREF="mailto:mageia-discuss%40mageia.org?Subject=Re%3A%20%5BMageia-discuss%5D%20Sun%20java%20updates%20must%20now%20be%20downloaded%20and%0A%09installed%20manually.&In-Reply-To=%3C1780051.Xcm09Uc4ut%40beteigeuze.oli-home%3E"
+ TITLE="[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.">oliver.bgr at googlemail.com
+ </A><BR>
+ <I>Wed Nov 23 10:09:25 CET 2011</I>
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+<PRE>Am Mittwoch, 23. November 2011, 09:56:24 schrieb Thorsten van Lil:
+&gt;<i> Where do we want to draw the line, as we did the same for skype?
+</I>But there is no really usable alternative for skype is there? Ok, there is
+ekiga and others, but you can't use them to communicate with skype users.
+And: skype is an end user software. So there will be quite some people using
+skype who won't find their way to skype.com...
+
+&gt;<i> We propagate the repositories as one main advantage of Linux. Everything
+</I>&gt;<i> is in one trusted source. No more seeking and downloading somewhere in
+</I>&gt;<i> the web from several sites. Automated updates. How should the uninformed
+</I>&gt;<i> and lazy user understand, that we didn't provide at least a &quot;get-java&quot;
+</I>&gt;<i> package?
+</I>Everything from one trusted source is all right with me, but we don't know
+anything about the trustworthyness of skype, oracle, adobe,...
+Or let's say, we have an opinion about that, but I won't voice it in public
+not to be the target of legal issues :/
+
+And as I said, people needing oracle java instead of OpenJDK will most likely
+be developers, so They know, how to install it. Or they are playing arround
+with stuff downloadad from some site in the web anyway, so why bother to keep
+the rest of their system clean?
+
+Oliver
+</PRE>
+
+
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+ <H1>[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.</H1>
+ <B>Wolfgang Bornath</B>
+ <A HREF="mailto:mageia-discuss%40mageia.org?Subject=Re%3A%20%5BMageia-discuss%5D%20Sun%20java%20updates%20must%20now%20be%20downloaded%20and%0A%20installed%20manually.&In-Reply-To=%3CCA%2Bh4nj5-asFao-TzkvsZRN9Oob%2BZ0Nc3f-s7HBM%3DHdfMhpAgvQ%40mail.gmail.com%3E"
+ TITLE="[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.">molch.b at googlemail.com
+ </A><BR>
+ <I>Wed Nov 23 10:09:39 CET 2011</I>
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+<PRE>2011/11/23 Thorsten van Lil &lt;<A HREF="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-discuss">tvl83 at gmx.de</A>&gt;:
+&gt;<i> Am 23.11.2011 09:33, schrieb Oliver Burger:
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i> Am Mittwoch, 23. November 2011, 09:22:03 schrieb Alejandro L&#243;pez:
+</I>&gt;&gt;&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;&gt;&gt;<i> On Wed, Nov 23, 2011 at 1:32 AM, D.Morgan&lt;<A HREF="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-discuss">dmorganec at gmail.com</A>&gt; &#160;wrote:
+</I>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;<i> Why ? &#160;openjdk is good enough to replace oracle java.
+</I>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;<i> and soonish we will have java7 too in mageia so i really don't see now
+</I>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;<i> the need of the closed source one.
+</I>&gt;&gt;&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;&gt;&gt;<i> Everything you said is true, but let me disagree with your question. Why
+</I>&gt;&gt;&gt;<i> not? Some users might prefer Oracle's java, while others might rather use
+</I>&gt;&gt;&gt;<i> OpenJDK. As long as there are volunteers for maintaining both packages,
+</I>&gt;&gt;&gt;<i> why
+</I>&gt;&gt;&gt;<i> shou;d it be one or the other? Why not providing both?
+</I>&gt;&gt;&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i> let me answer this from another perspective.
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i> Mageia is an OpenSource project. So it should be our main goal to promote
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i> OpenSource software.
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i> So why should we bother to promote Oracle Jave by creating a workarround
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i> in
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i> our packaging system, when they are clearly moving away from the
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i> OpenSource
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i> community?
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i> Because the users expect to have it in the repositories. It may be used
+</I>&gt;<i> against Mageia, if it is not in there (as for flash, proprietary drivers,
+</I>&gt;<i> ...).
+</I>&gt;<i> Where do we want to draw the line, as we did the same for skype?
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i> We propagate the repositories as one main advantage of Linux. Everything is
+</I>&gt;<i> in one trusted source. No more seeking and downloading somewhere in the web
+</I>&gt;<i> from several sites. Automated updates. How should the uninformed and lazy
+</I>&gt;<i> user understand, that we didn't provide at least a &quot;get-java&quot; package?
+</I>
+Yes, you are right: where do we want to draw the line? 2 points:
+ - Oliver talked about Oracle moving away from Open Source users.
+ - Oracle java (as Adobe Reader) is not essential for the majority of
+users like flashplayer and proprietary drivers and firmware.
+
+Maybe these points provide the &quot;line to draw&quot; - otherwise we can move
+on to all kinds of closed source games and whatever. Users always
+&quot;want&quot;, it is in their genes.
+
+--
+wobo
+</PRE>
+
+
+
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+ <H1>[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.</H1>
+ <B>nicolas vigier</B>
+ <A HREF="mailto:mageia-discuss%40mageia.org?Subject=Re%3A%20%5BMageia-discuss%5D%20Sun%20java%20updates%20must%20now%20be%20downloaded%0A%09and%09installed%20manually.&In-Reply-To=%3C20111123120352.GP21938%40mars-attacks.org%3E"
+ TITLE="[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.">boklm at mars-attacks.org
+ </A><BR>
+ <I>Wed Nov 23 13:03:52 CET 2011</I>
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+<PRE>On Wed, 23 Nov 2011, Alejandro L&#243;pez wrote:
+
+&gt;<i> On Wed, Nov 23, 2011 at 1:32 AM, D.Morgan &lt;<A HREF="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-discuss">dmorganec at gmail.com</A>&gt; wrote:
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt; On Sat, Nov 19, 2011 at 6:27 PM, Markus Ueberall
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt; &lt;<A HREF="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-discuss">Markus.Ueberall at gmail.com</A>&gt; wrote:
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt; &gt; Am 18.11.2011 04:52, schrieb David W. Hodgins:
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt; &gt;&gt; Agreed. Just want to make sure that anyone who is using the
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt; &gt;&gt; sun java package from the repositories know that they must
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt; &gt;&gt; get the latest security updates directly from java.com, as
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt; &gt;&gt; the packages in the Mageia repositories are not being updated.
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt; &gt;&gt;
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt; &gt;&gt; Regards, Dave Hodgins
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt; &gt;
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt; &gt; Hi,
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt; &gt;
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt; &gt; I wonder whether it is feasible to come up with a &quot;get-sun-java&quot; rpm
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt; &gt; which uses the same mechanism as the get-skype rpm for those who
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt; &gt; need/prefer Oracle's implementation?
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt; &gt;
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt; &gt; Ad astra, Markus
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt;
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt; Why ? openjdk is good enough to replace oracle java.
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt; and soonish we will have java7 too in mageia so i really don't see now
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt; the need of the closed source one.
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt;
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i> Everything you said is true, but let me disagree with your question. Why
+</I>&gt;<i> not? Some users might prefer Oracle's java, while others might rather use
+</I>&gt;<i> OpenJDK. As long as there are volunteers for maintaining both packages, why
+</I>&gt;<i> shou;d it be one or the other? Why not providing both?
+</I>
+There is maybe volunteers to maintain oracle java package, but I don't
+think there is many volunteers to maintain the full java stack with both
+JVMs. We already have too few people maintaining the java packages, so
+if we can avoid giving them more work by supporting multiple JVMs,
+that's better.
+
+That's also why we try to have if possible only one version of gcc, perl,
+python, ruby, etc ...
+
+</PRE>
+
+
+
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+ <B>Marja van Waes</B>
+ <A HREF="mailto:mageia-discuss%40mageia.org?Subject=Re%3A%20%5BMageia-discuss%5D%20Fwd%3A%20%5BFOSDEM%5D%20Call%20for%20stands%2C%0A%20devroom%20talks%20and%20lightning%20talks&In-Reply-To=%3C4ECCED5F.3090103%40xs4all.nl%3E"
+ TITLE="[Mageia-discuss] Fwd: [FOSDEM] Call for stands, devroom talks and lightning talks">marja11 at xs4all.nl
+ </A><BR>
+ <I>Wed Nov 23 13:55:59 CET 2011</I>
+ <P><UL>
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+<!--beginarticle-->
+<PRE>Op 23-11-11 08:58, Marja van Waes schreef:
+&gt;<i> Op 22-11-11 09:52, Romain d'Alverny schreef:
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i> Hi guys,
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i> FOSDEM is calling! (4-5 February, in Brussels, Belgium)
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i> - who would like to act there as a Mageia member? (booth, conference)
+</I>&gt;<i> FOSDEM is for developers. So you need developers for the booth?
+</I>&gt;<i> If not, you can list me for it.
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>Trish told me that ideally, for the booth, it would be great to have
+people from all teams, so I put my name on our Fosdem 2012 page.
+</PRE>
+
+
+
+
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+ <H1>[Mageia-discuss] Fwd: [FOSDEM] Call for stands, devroom talks and lightning talks</H1>
+ <B>Patricia Fraser</B>
+ <A HREF="mailto:mageia-discuss%40mageia.org?Subject=Re%3A%20%5BMageia-discuss%5D%20Fwd%3A%20%5BFOSDEM%5D%20Call%20for%20stands%2C%0A%20devroom%20talks%20and%20lightning%20talks&In-Reply-To=%3C20111123182649.000e0ca2%40andromeda%3E"
+ TITLE="[Mageia-discuss] Fwd: [FOSDEM] Call for stands, devroom talks and lightning talks">trish at thefrasers.org
+ </A><BR>
+ <I>Wed Nov 23 18:26:49 CET 2011</I>
+ <P><UL>
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+<!--beginarticle-->
+<PRE>
+&gt;<i> FOSDEM is calling! (4-5 February, in Brussels, Belgium)
+</I>
+This is a call for any and all Mageia people - ideally it would be great
+to have people from the whole community, whether you're in a team or
+not. One of the main reasons to have a stand is to promote Mageia,
+as well as to encourage people to join *all* our teams - devs, artwork,
+bugsquad, QA, marcom - you name it. The more the merrier!
+
+Hope to see you there!
+
+--
+Trish Fraser, JD9R RQ2D
+52.4161N,16.9303E
+Wed Nov 23 18:24:12 CET 2011
+GNU/Linux 1997-2011 #283226 linuxcounter.net
+andromeda up 0 hour(s), 16 min.
+kernel 2.6.38.8-desktop-8.mga
+--
+-------------- next part --------------
+A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
+Name: signature.asc
+Type: application/pgp-signature
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+</PRE>
+
+
+
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+ <LINK REL="made" HREF="mailto:mageia-discuss%40mageia.org?Subject=Re%3A%20%5BMageia-discuss%5D%20Sun%20java%20updates%20must%20now%20be%20downloaded%20and%0A%09installed%20manually.&In-Reply-To=%3C201111231922.28888.alien%40rmail.be%3E">
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+ <H1>[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.</H1>
+ <B>Maarten Vanraes</B>
+ <A HREF="mailto:mageia-discuss%40mageia.org?Subject=Re%3A%20%5BMageia-discuss%5D%20Sun%20java%20updates%20must%20now%20be%20downloaded%20and%0A%09installed%20manually.&In-Reply-To=%3C201111231922.28888.alien%40rmail.be%3E"
+ TITLE="[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.">alien at rmail.be
+ </A><BR>
+ <I>Wed Nov 23 19:22:28 CET 2011</I>
+ <P><UL>
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+<!--beginarticle-->
+<PRE>Op woensdag 23 november 2011 10:09:39 schreef Wolfgang Bornath:
+[...]
+&gt;<i> &gt; Where do we want to draw the line, as we did the same for skype?
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt;
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt; We propagate the repositories as one main advantage of Linux. Everything
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt; is in one trusted source. No more seeking and downloading somewhere in
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt; the web from several sites. Automated updates. How should the uninformed
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt; and lazy user understand, that we didn't provide at least a &quot;get-java&quot;
+</I>&gt;<i> &gt; package?
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i> Yes, you are right: where do we want to draw the line? 2 points:
+</I>&gt;<i> - Oliver talked about Oracle moving away from Open Source users.
+</I>&gt;<i> - Oracle java (as Adobe Reader) is not essential for the majority of
+</I>&gt;<i> users like flashplayer and proprietary drivers and firmware.
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i> Maybe these points provide the &quot;line to draw&quot; - otherwise we can move
+</I>&gt;<i> on to all kinds of closed source games and whatever. Users always
+</I>&gt;<i> &quot;want&quot;, it is in their genes.
+</I>
+My personal opinion is that if a contributor is willing and able to legally
+provide/distribute it, whatever it's status, he's free to do so. who are we to
+say to that contributor that his work is in vain?
+
+i mean, what is essential to whom??? it's a very subjective pov, so i say,
+don't draw a unneeded line.
+</PRE>
+
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+ <H1>[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.</H1>
+ <B>andre999</B>
+ <A HREF="mailto:mageia-discuss%40mageia.org?Subject=Re%3A%20%5BMageia-discuss%5D%20Sun%20java%20updates%20must%20now%20be%20downloaded%09and%0A%20installed%20manually.&In-Reply-To=%3C4ECD7403.30900%40laposte.net%3E"
+ TITLE="[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.">andre999mga at laposte.net
+ </A><BR>
+ <I>Wed Nov 23 23:30:27 CET 2011</I>
+ <P><UL>
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+<!--beginarticle-->
+<PRE>nicolas vigier a &#233;crit :
+&gt;<i> On Wed, 23 Nov 2011, Alejandro L&#243;pez wrote:
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i> On Wed, Nov 23, 2011 at 1:32 AM, D.Morgan&lt;<A HREF="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-discuss">dmorganec at gmail.com</A>&gt; wrote:
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;&gt;&gt;<i> On Sat, Nov 19, 2011 at 6:27 PM, Markus Ueberall
+</I>&gt;&gt;&gt;<i> &lt;<A HREF="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-discuss">Markus.Ueberall at gmail.com</A>&gt; wrote:
+</I>&gt;&gt;&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;<i> Am 18.11.2011 04:52, schrieb David W. Hodgins:
+</I>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;<i> Agreed. Just want to make sure that anyone who is using the
+</I>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;<i> sun java package from the repositories know that they must
+</I>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;<i> get the latest security updates directly from java.com, as
+</I>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;<i> the packages in the Mageia repositories are not being updated.
+</I>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;<i> Regards, Dave Hodgins
+</I>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;<i> Hi,
+</I>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;<i> I wonder whether it is feasible to come up with a &quot;get-sun-java&quot; rpm
+</I>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;<i> which uses the same mechanism as the get-skype rpm for those who
+</I>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;<i> need/prefer Oracle's implementation?
+</I>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;<i> Ad astra, Markus
+</I>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;&gt;&gt;<i> Why ? openjdk is good enough to replace oracle java.
+</I>&gt;&gt;&gt;<i> and soonish we will have java7 too in mageia so i really don't see now
+</I>&gt;&gt;&gt;<i> the need of the closed source one.
+</I>&gt;&gt;&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;&gt;&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i> Everything you said is true, but let me disagree with your question. Why
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i> not? Some users might prefer Oracle's java, while others might rather use
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i> OpenJDK. As long as there are volunteers for maintaining both packages, why
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i> shou;d it be one or the other? Why not providing both?
+</I>&gt;&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i> There is maybe volunteers to maintain oracle java package, but I don't
+</I>&gt;<i> think there is many volunteers to maintain the full java stack with both
+</I>&gt;<i> JVMs. We already have too few people maintaining the java packages, so
+</I>&gt;<i> if we can avoid giving them more work by supporting multiple JVMs,
+</I>&gt;<i> that's better.
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i> That's also why we try to have if possible only one version of gcc, perl,
+</I>&gt;<i> python, ruby, etc ...
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>&gt;<i>
+</I>I agree. We have lots of other areas to put our packaging ressources.
+As well, unless the policy has changed, users can get automatic update
+notices for Sun java.
+
+Also, I've noticed that some (if not most) packages which required Sun
+java in the past (from upstream bug reports) now work well with OpenJDK.
+
+--
+Andr&#233;
+
+</PRE>
+
+<!--endarticle-->
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+ <h1>23 November 2011 Archives by author</h1>
+ <ul>
+ <li> <b>Messages sorted by:</b>
+ <a href="thread.html#start">[ thread ]</a>
+ <a href="subject.html#start">[ subject ]</a>
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+
+ <li><b><a href="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-discuss">More info on this list...
+ </a></b></li>
+ </ul>
+ <p><b>Starting:</b> <i>Wed Nov 23 00:50:51 CET 2011</i><br>
+ <b>Ending:</b> <i>Wed Nov 23 23:30:27 CET 2011</i><br>
+ <b>Messages:</b> 18<p>
+ <ul>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005929.html">[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.
+</A><A NAME="5929">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Wolfgang Bornath
+</I>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005933.html">[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.
+</A><A NAME="5933">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Wolfgang Bornath
+</I>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005930.html">[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.
+</A><A NAME="5930">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Oliver Burger
+</I>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005932.html">[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.
+</A><A NAME="5932">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Oliver Burger
+</I>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005926.html">[Mageia-discuss] mandriva rpms versus cpan versus ?
+</A><A NAME="5926">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Sandro CAZZANIGA
+</I>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005924.html">[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.
+</A><A NAME="5924">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>D.Morgan
+</I>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005936.html">[Mageia-discuss] Fwd: [FOSDEM] Call for stands, devroom talks and lightning talks
+</A><A NAME="5936">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Patricia Fraser
+</I>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005921.html">[Mageia-discuss] mandriva rpms versus cpan versus ?
+</A><A NAME="5921">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Florian Hubold
+</I>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005922.html">[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.
+</A><A NAME="5922">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Barry Jackson
+</I>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005931.html">[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.
+</A><A NAME="5931">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Thorsten van Lil
+</I>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005928.html">[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.
+</A><A NAME="5928">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Alejandro L&#243;pez
+</I>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005923.html">[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.
+</A><A NAME="5923">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Maarten Vanraes
+</I>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005937.html">[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.
+</A><A NAME="5937">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Maarten Vanraes
+</I>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005927.html">[Mageia-discuss] Fwd: [FOSDEM] Call for stands, devroom talks and lightning talks
+</A><A NAME="5927">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Marja van Waes
+</I>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005935.html">[Mageia-discuss] Fwd: [FOSDEM] Call for stands, devroom talks and lightning talks
+</A><A NAME="5935">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Marja van Waes
+</I>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005938.html">[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.
+</A><A NAME="5938">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>andre999
+</I>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005925.html">[Mageia-discuss] mandriva rpms versus cpan versus ?
+</A><A NAME="5925">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>bascule
+</I>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005934.html">[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.
+</A><A NAME="5934">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>nicolas vigier
+</I>
+
+ </ul>
+ <p>
+ <a name="end"><b>Last message date:</b></a>
+ <i>Wed Nov 23 23:30:27 CET 2011</i><br>
+ <b>Archived on:</b> <i>Wed Nov 23 23:30:39 CET 2011</i>
+ <p>
+ <ul>
+ <li> <b>Messages sorted by:</b>
+ <a href="thread.html#start">[ thread ]</a>
+ <a href="subject.html#start">[ subject ]</a>
+
+ <a href="date.html#start">[ date ]</a>
+ <li><b><a href="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-discuss">More info on this list...
+ </a></b></li>
+ </ul>
+ <p>
+ <hr>
+ <i>This archive was generated by
+ Pipermail 0.09 (Mailman edition).</i>
+ </BODY>
+</HTML>
+
diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/20111123/date.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/20111123/date.html
new file mode 100644
index 000000000..25b4a53f4
--- /dev/null
+++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/20111123/date.html
@@ -0,0 +1,137 @@
+<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 3.2//EN">
+<HTML>
+ <HEAD>
+ <title>The Mageia-discuss 23 November 2011 Archive by date</title>
+ <META NAME="robots" CONTENT="noindex,follow">
+ <META http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=us-ascii">
+ </HEAD>
+ <BODY BGCOLOR="#ffffff">
+ <a name="start"></A>
+ <h1>23 November 2011 Archives by date</h1>
+ <ul>
+ <li> <b>Messages sorted by:</b>
+ <a href="thread.html#start">[ thread ]</a>
+ <a href="subject.html#start">[ subject ]</a>
+ <a href="author.html#start">[ author ]</a>
+
+
+ <li><b><a href="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-discuss">More info on this list...
+ </a></b></li>
+ </ul>
+ <p><b>Starting:</b> <i>Wed Nov 23 00:50:51 CET 2011</i><br>
+ <b>Ending:</b> <i>Wed Nov 23 23:30:27 CET 2011</i><br>
+ <b>Messages:</b> 18<p>
+ <ul>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005921.html">[Mageia-discuss] mandriva rpms versus cpan versus ?
+</A><A NAME="5921">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Florian Hubold
+</I>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005922.html">[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.
+</A><A NAME="5922">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Barry Jackson
+</I>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005923.html">[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.
+</A><A NAME="5923">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Maarten Vanraes
+</I>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005924.html">[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.
+</A><A NAME="5924">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>D.Morgan
+</I>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005925.html">[Mageia-discuss] mandriva rpms versus cpan versus ?
+</A><A NAME="5925">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>bascule
+</I>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005926.html">[Mageia-discuss] mandriva rpms versus cpan versus ?
+</A><A NAME="5926">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Sandro CAZZANIGA
+</I>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005927.html">[Mageia-discuss] Fwd: [FOSDEM] Call for stands, devroom talks and lightning talks
+</A><A NAME="5927">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Marja van Waes
+</I>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005928.html">[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.
+</A><A NAME="5928">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Alejandro L&#243;pez
+</I>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005929.html">[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.
+</A><A NAME="5929">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Wolfgang Bornath
+</I>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005930.html">[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.
+</A><A NAME="5930">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Oliver Burger
+</I>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005931.html">[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.
+</A><A NAME="5931">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Thorsten van Lil
+</I>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005932.html">[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.
+</A><A NAME="5932">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Oliver Burger
+</I>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005933.html">[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.
+</A><A NAME="5933">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Wolfgang Bornath
+</I>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005934.html">[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.
+</A><A NAME="5934">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>nicolas vigier
+</I>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005935.html">[Mageia-discuss] Fwd: [FOSDEM] Call for stands, devroom talks and lightning talks
+</A><A NAME="5935">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Marja van Waes
+</I>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005936.html">[Mageia-discuss] Fwd: [FOSDEM] Call for stands, devroom talks and lightning talks
+</A><A NAME="5936">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Patricia Fraser
+</I>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005937.html">[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.
+</A><A NAME="5937">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Maarten Vanraes
+</I>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005938.html">[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.
+</A><A NAME="5938">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>andre999
+</I>
+
+ </ul>
+ <p>
+ <a name="end"><b>Last message date:</b></a>
+ <i>Wed Nov 23 23:30:27 CET 2011</i><br>
+ <b>Archived on:</b> <i>Wed Nov 23 23:30:39 CET 2011</i>
+ <p>
+ <ul>
+ <li> <b>Messages sorted by:</b>
+ <a href="thread.html#start">[ thread ]</a>
+ <a href="subject.html#start">[ subject ]</a>
+ <a href="author.html#start">[ author ]</a>
+
+ <li><b><a href="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-discuss">More info on this list...
+ </a></b></li>
+ </ul>
+ <p>
+ <hr>
+ <i>This archive was generated by
+ Pipermail 0.09 (Mailman edition).</i>
+ </BODY>
+</HTML>
+
diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/20111123/index.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/20111123/index.html
new file mode 120000
index 000000000..db4b46f72
--- /dev/null
+++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/20111123/index.html
@@ -0,0 +1 @@
+thread.html \ No newline at end of file
diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/20111123/subject.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/20111123/subject.html
new file mode 100644
index 000000000..1bcb75b06
--- /dev/null
+++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/20111123/subject.html
@@ -0,0 +1,137 @@
+<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 3.2//EN">
+<HTML>
+ <HEAD>
+ <title>The Mageia-discuss 23 November 2011 Archive by subject</title>
+ <META NAME="robots" CONTENT="noindex,follow">
+ <META http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=us-ascii">
+ </HEAD>
+ <BODY BGCOLOR="#ffffff">
+ <a name="start"></A>
+ <h1>23 November 2011 Archives by subject</h1>
+ <ul>
+ <li> <b>Messages sorted by:</b>
+ <a href="thread.html#start">[ thread ]</a>
+
+ <a href="author.html#start">[ author ]</a>
+ <a href="date.html#start">[ date ]</a>
+
+ <li><b><a href="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-discuss">More info on this list...
+ </a></b></li>
+ </ul>
+ <p><b>Starting:</b> <i>Wed Nov 23 00:50:51 CET 2011</i><br>
+ <b>Ending:</b> <i>Wed Nov 23 23:30:27 CET 2011</i><br>
+ <b>Messages:</b> 18<p>
+ <ul>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005927.html">[Mageia-discuss] Fwd: [FOSDEM] Call for stands, devroom talks and lightning talks
+</A><A NAME="5927">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Marja van Waes
+</I>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005935.html">[Mageia-discuss] Fwd: [FOSDEM] Call for stands, devroom talks and lightning talks
+</A><A NAME="5935">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Marja van Waes
+</I>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005936.html">[Mageia-discuss] Fwd: [FOSDEM] Call for stands, devroom talks and lightning talks
+</A><A NAME="5936">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Patricia Fraser
+</I>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005921.html">[Mageia-discuss] mandriva rpms versus cpan versus ?
+</A><A NAME="5921">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Florian Hubold
+</I>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005925.html">[Mageia-discuss] mandriva rpms versus cpan versus ?
+</A><A NAME="5925">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>bascule
+</I>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005926.html">[Mageia-discuss] mandriva rpms versus cpan versus ?
+</A><A NAME="5926">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Sandro CAZZANIGA
+</I>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005934.html">[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.
+</A><A NAME="5934">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>nicolas vigier
+</I>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005938.html">[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.
+</A><A NAME="5938">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>andre999
+</I>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005923.html">[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.
+</A><A NAME="5923">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Maarten Vanraes
+</I>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005930.html">[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.
+</A><A NAME="5930">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Oliver Burger
+</I>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005932.html">[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.
+</A><A NAME="5932">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Oliver Burger
+</I>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005937.html">[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.
+</A><A NAME="5937">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Maarten Vanraes
+</I>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005922.html">[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.
+</A><A NAME="5922">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Barry Jackson
+</I>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005924.html">[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.
+</A><A NAME="5924">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>D.Morgan
+</I>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005928.html">[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.
+</A><A NAME="5928">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Alejandro L&#243;pez
+</I>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005929.html">[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.
+</A><A NAME="5929">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Wolfgang Bornath
+</I>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005931.html">[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.
+</A><A NAME="5931">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Thorsten van Lil
+</I>
+
+<LI><A HREF="005933.html">[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.
+</A><A NAME="5933">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Wolfgang Bornath
+</I>
+
+ </ul>
+ <p>
+ <a name="end"><b>Last message date:</b></a>
+ <i>Wed Nov 23 23:30:27 CET 2011</i><br>
+ <b>Archived on:</b> <i>Wed Nov 23 23:30:39 CET 2011</i>
+ <p>
+ <ul>
+ <li> <b>Messages sorted by:</b>
+ <a href="thread.html#start">[ thread ]</a>
+
+ <a href="author.html#start">[ author ]</a>
+ <a href="date.html#start">[ date ]</a>
+ <li><b><a href="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-discuss">More info on this list...
+ </a></b></li>
+ </ul>
+ <p>
+ <hr>
+ <i>This archive was generated by
+ Pipermail 0.09 (Mailman edition).</i>
+ </BODY>
+</HTML>
+
diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/20111123/thread.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/20111123/thread.html
new file mode 100644
index 000000000..7ac70eee9
--- /dev/null
+++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-discuss/20111123/thread.html
@@ -0,0 +1,169 @@
+<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 3.2//EN">
+<HTML>
+ <HEAD>
+ <title>The Mageia-discuss 23 November 2011 Archive by thread</title>
+ <META NAME="robots" CONTENT="noindex,follow">
+ <META http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=us-ascii">
+ </HEAD>
+ <BODY BGCOLOR="#ffffff">
+ <a name="start"></A>
+ <h1>23 November 2011 Archives by thread</h1>
+ <ul>
+ <li> <b>Messages sorted by:</b>
+
+ <a href="subject.html#start">[ subject ]</a>
+ <a href="author.html#start">[ author ]</a>
+ <a href="date.html#start">[ date ]</a>
+
+ <li><b><a href="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-discuss">More info on this list...
+ </a></b></li>
+ </ul>
+ <p><b>Starting:</b> <i>Wed Nov 23 00:50:51 CET 2011</i><br>
+ <b>Ending:</b> <i>Wed Nov 23 23:30:27 CET 2011</i><br>
+ <b>Messages:</b> 18<p>
+ <ul>
+
+<!--0 01322005851- -->
+<LI><A HREF="005921.html">[Mageia-discuss] mandriva rpms versus cpan versus ?
+</A><A NAME="5921">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Florian Hubold
+</I>
+
+<UL>
+<!--1 01322005851-01322029830- -->
+<LI><A HREF="005925.html">[Mageia-discuss] mandriva rpms versus cpan versus ?
+</A><A NAME="5925">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>bascule
+</I>
+
+<!--1 01322005851-01322029988- -->
+<LI><A HREF="005926.html">[Mageia-discuss] mandriva rpms versus cpan versus ?
+</A><A NAME="5926">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Sandro CAZZANIGA
+</I>
+
+</UL>
+<!--0 01322007545- -->
+<LI><A HREF="005922.html">[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.
+</A><A NAME="5922">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Barry Jackson
+</I>
+
+<UL>
+<!--1 01322007545-01322008087- -->
+<LI><A HREF="005923.html">[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.
+</A><A NAME="5923">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Maarten Vanraes
+</I>
+
+</UL>
+<!--0 01322008348- -->
+<LI><A HREF="005924.html">[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.
+</A><A NAME="5924">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>D.Morgan
+</I>
+
+<UL>
+<!--1 01322008348-01322036523- -->
+<LI><A HREF="005928.html">[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.
+</A><A NAME="5928">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Alejandro L&#243;pez
+</I>
+
+<UL>
+<!--2 01322008348-01322036523-01322037155- -->
+<LI><A HREF="005929.html">[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.
+</A><A NAME="5929">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Wolfgang Bornath
+</I>
+
+<!--2 01322008348-01322036523-01322037201- -->
+<LI><A HREF="005930.html">[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.
+</A><A NAME="5930">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Oliver Burger
+</I>
+
+<UL>
+<!--3 01322008348-01322036523-01322037201-01322038584- -->
+<LI><A HREF="005931.html">[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.
+</A><A NAME="5931">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Thorsten van Lil
+</I>
+
+<!--3 01322008348-01322036523-01322037201-01322038584-01322039365- -->
+<LI><A HREF="005932.html">[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.
+</A><A NAME="5932">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Oliver Burger
+</I>
+
+<!--3 01322008348-01322036523-01322037201-01322038584-01322039379- -->
+<LI><A HREF="005933.html">[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.
+</A><A NAME="5933">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Wolfgang Bornath
+</I>
+
+<!--3 01322008348-01322036523-01322037201-01322038584-01322039379-01322072548- -->
+<LI><A HREF="005937.html">[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.
+</A><A NAME="5937">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Maarten Vanraes
+</I>
+
+</UL>
+<!--2 01322008348-01322036523-01322049832- -->
+<LI><A HREF="005934.html">[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.
+</A><A NAME="5934">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>nicolas vigier
+</I>
+
+<UL>
+<!--3 01322008348-01322036523-01322049832-01322087427- -->
+<LI><A HREF="005938.html">[Mageia-discuss] Sun java updates must now be downloaded and installed manually.
+</A><A NAME="5938">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>andre999
+</I>
+
+</UL>
+</UL>
+</UL>
+<!--0 01322035096- -->
+<LI><A HREF="005927.html">[Mageia-discuss] Fwd: [FOSDEM] Call for stands, devroom talks and lightning talks
+</A><A NAME="5927">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Marja van Waes
+</I>
+
+<UL>
+<!--1 01322035096-01322052959- -->
+<LI><A HREF="005935.html">[Mageia-discuss] Fwd: [FOSDEM] Call for stands, devroom talks and lightning talks
+</A><A NAME="5935">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Marja van Waes
+</I>
+
+</UL>
+<!--0 01322069209- -->
+<LI><A HREF="005936.html">[Mageia-discuss] Fwd: [FOSDEM] Call for stands, devroom talks and lightning talks
+</A><A NAME="5936">&nbsp;</A>
+<I>Patricia Fraser
+</I>
+
+ </ul>
+ <p>
+ <a name="end"><b>Last message date:</b></a>
+ <i>Wed Nov 23 23:30:27 CET 2011</i><br>
+ <b>Archived on:</b> <i>Wed Nov 23 23:30:39 CET 2011</i>
+ <p>
+ <ul>
+ <li> <b>Messages sorted by:</b>
+
+ <a href="subject.html#start">[ subject ]</a>
+ <a href="author.html#start">[ author ]</a>
+ <a href="date.html#start">[ date ]</a>
+ <li><b><a href="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-discuss">More info on this list...
+ </a></b></li>
+ </ul>
+ <p>
+ <hr>
+ <i>This archive was generated by
+ Pipermail 0.09 (Mailman edition).</i>
+ </BODY>
+</HTML>
+