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diff --git a/zarb-ml/mageia-dev/2012-January/011197.html b/zarb-ml/mageia-dev/2012-January/011197.html new file mode 100644 index 000000000..c8444f445 --- /dev/null +++ b/zarb-ml/mageia-dev/2012-January/011197.html @@ -0,0 +1,264 @@ +<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 3.2//EN"> +<HTML> + <HEAD> + <TITLE> [Mageia-dev] [RFC] Moving various packages/codecs to tainted + </TITLE> + <LINK REL="Index" HREF="index.html" > + <LINK REL="made" HREF="mailto:mageia-dev%40mageia.org?Subject=Re%3A%20%5BMageia-dev%5D%20%5BRFC%5D%20Moving%20various%20packages/codecs%20to%20tainted&In-Reply-To=%3C4F0BBD07.4070908%40laposte.net%3E"> + <META NAME="robots" CONTENT="index,nofollow"> + <META http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=us-ascii"> + <LINK REL="Previous" HREF="011195.html"> + <LINK REL="Next" HREF="011203.html"> + </HEAD> + <BODY BGCOLOR="#ffffff"> + <H1>[Mageia-dev] [RFC] Moving various packages/codecs to tainted</H1> + <B>andre999</B> + <A HREF="mailto:mageia-dev%40mageia.org?Subject=Re%3A%20%5BMageia-dev%5D%20%5BRFC%5D%20Moving%20various%20packages/codecs%20to%20tainted&In-Reply-To=%3C4F0BBD07.4070908%40laposte.net%3E" + TITLE="[Mageia-dev] [RFC] Moving various packages/codecs to tainted">andre999mga at laposte.net + </A><BR> + <I>Tue Jan 10 05:22:31 CET 2012</I> + <P><UL> + <LI>Previous message: <A HREF="011195.html">[Mageia-dev] [RFC] Moving various packages/codecs to tainted +</A></li> + <LI>Next message: <A HREF="011203.html">[Mageia-dev] [RFC] Moving various packages/codecs to tainted +</A></li> + <LI> <B>Messages sorted by:</B> + <a href="date.html#11197">[ date ]</a> + <a href="thread.html#11197">[ thread ]</a> + <a href="subject.html#11197">[ subject ]</a> + <a href="author.html#11197">[ author ]</a> + </LI> + </UL> + <HR> +<!--beginarticle--> +<PRE>Anssi Hannula a écrit : +><i> On 10.01.2012 04:08, David Walser wrote: +</I>><i> +</I>>><i> Anssi Hannula wrote: +</I>>><i> +</I>>>><i> On 10.01.2012 01:30, David Walser wrote: +</I>>>><i> +</I>>>>><i> Anssi Hannula wrote: +</I>>>>><i> +</I>>>>>><i> Hi all! +</I>>>>>><i> +</I>>>>>><i> As I've noted in some previous emails, our core/tainted media codec +</I>>>>>><i> split-up is currently arbitrary without any specific logic. +</I>>>>>><i> +</I>>>>>><i> As far as I remember, the tainted policy is that codecs for formats that +</I>>>>>><i> are claimed to be covered by patents should be there. +</I>>>>>><i> +</I>>>>>><i> Per that policy, at least the AC-3/DTS/MP3/MPEG-2/MPEG-4/H.264/VC-1 +</I>>>>>><i> decoders and AC-3/MPEG-2/MPEG-4 encoders we have in core should be moved +</I>>>>>><i> to tainted section. Note that this will make most current +</I>>>>>><i> .mkv/.avi/.mp4/.mov/.wmv/.mp3 files unplayable without packages from +</I>>>>>><i> tainted section. +</I>>>>>><i> +</I>>>>><i> That's the absolute last thing I want to see happen. It's one of the reasons Fedora and others that do that are not viable options for a +</I>>>>><i> +</I>>><i> lot +</I>>><i> +</I>>>>><i> of non-technical users, and it just makes it so you have to jump through a lot of extra hoops just to have a reasonably working system +</I>>>>><i> (whether it's your own or for family members that you might be maintaining). Obvouisly just about every codec in use has patents relevant +</I>>>>><i> +</I>>><i> to +</I>>><i> +</I>>>>><i> it, but I think we're OK to stick with the ones Mandriva shipped for years in core (like mp3 decoding) and things that were in PLF in +</I>>>>><i> +</I>>><i> tainted +</I>>><i> +</I>>>>><i> (like mp3 encoding) even if it seems arbitrary. If anything, it'd be nice if more not-likely-to-be-problematic codecs could be moved to +</I>>>>><i> core. +</I>>>>><i> +</I>>>><i> I'm absolutely fine with either moving codecs to core or tainted, as +</I>>>><i> long as we are at least somewhat consistent in what is in core and what +</I>>>><i> is in tainted. However, I do not really like the reasoning "we do it +</I>>>><i> like mandriva did no matter if it is sensible or not". +</I>>>><i> +</I>>>><i> I'd possibly understand "we do it like mandriva did because they didn't +</I>>>><i> apparently have problems with these pkgs", but it IMHO wouldn't really +</I>>>><i> fly as we could just s/mandriva/ubuntu/ in that statement (and Ubuntu is +</I>>>><i> much more prominent than mdv IMO) and then everything would be in core... +</I>>>><i> +</I>>><i> Sure, I but I think Mandriva achieved a good balance between respecting patents and not being overly paranoid. +</I>>><i> +</I>><i> The problem is that that "balance" was achieved by sticking packages in +</I>><i> PLF/main/contrib semi-randomly. For example, H.264 decoders and MPEG-4 +</I>><i> video encoders are in main/core, while e.g. AAC audio decoders are in +</I>><i> PLF/tainted. If one'd put them into an order, IMO H.264 and MPEG-4 would +</I>><i> be much more prominent and tainted candidates instead of AAC decoding... +</I>><i> Also, in e.g. MPEG-4 case we have encoders both in core and in tainted, +</I>><i> e.g. we have ffmpeg in core, but xvid in tainted. +</I>><i> +</I>><i> +</I>>><i> I suppose you can't blame a +</I>>><i> US company like RedHat for being overly paranoid, but as you said, Mandriva hasn't had any problems. Are there any there examples out of +</I>>><i> there of distros trying to achieve this balance? Obviously we don't want to follow Ubuntu or ROSA in pretending patents don't exist. +</I>>><i> +</I>><i> Linux Mint provides a "No codecs" CD: +</I>><i> <A HREF="http://www.linuxmint.com/download.php">http://www.linuxmint.com/download.php</A> +</I>><i> +</I>><i> Ubuntu has a patent policy (which basically IIRC says "rights owner or +</I>><i> packager, please contact us if you think there is an infringement, we +</I>><i> will investgate"): +</I>><i> <A HREF="https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PatentPolicy">https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PatentPolicy</A> +</I>><i> +</I> +This is the type of patent policy we should have. +It requires the registered patent holder to inform Ubuntu of the patent +claims and the specific package(s) involved before a patent claim is +considered by Ubuntu. +With this policy, probably most of the packages now in "tainted" could +be transfered to core. + +><i> Note also that the Ubuntu Live CD and therefore the default Ubuntu +</I>><i> installation do not contain any codecs. By default Totem is installed, +</I>><i> however, and gstreamer is plugged into "gnome-codec-install" (which +</I>><i> seems really nice, do we use it?), so that wen you try to play an +</I>><i> unsupported video the first time, it will prompt to install the codecs +</I>><i> (it will also show a warning dialog about patents etc, but AFAICS this +</I>><i> comes from gnome-codec-install itself, not Ubuntu). +</I>><i> +</I> +That sounds nice. The package that automatically found codecs in +Mandriva would give a lot of false positives, and would always go to a +paid site. I removed the package, and most (but not all) of the media +concerned worked without additional codecs. + +><i> If the user installs a video player depending on ffmpeg, e.g. VLC via +</I>><i> the software center, the codecs in ffmpeg will be pulled "normally", +</I>><i> i.e. silently. +</I>><i> +</I>><i> Linux Mint had also gstreamer plugged to gnome-codec-install, so the +</I>><i> codecs will be installed if the user tries to play such a video with +</I>><i> totem (again with warnings). +</I>><i> +</I> +We should look into doing something along these lines. +It would be advantageous however to have codec packages, for +installation before hand, as many users won't necessarily always an +Internet connexion available. + +-- +André + +</PRE> + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + +<!--endarticle--> + <HR> + <P><UL> + <!--threads--> + <LI>Previous message: <A HREF="011195.html">[Mageia-dev] [RFC] Moving various packages/codecs to tainted +</A></li> + <LI>Next message: <A HREF="011203.html">[Mageia-dev] [RFC] Moving various packages/codecs to tainted +</A></li> + <LI> <B>Messages sorted by:</B> + <a href="date.html#11197">[ date ]</a> + <a href="thread.html#11197">[ thread ]</a> + <a href="subject.html#11197">[ subject ]</a> + <a href="author.html#11197">[ author ]</a> + </LI> + </UL> + +<hr> +<a href="https://www.mageia.org/mailman/listinfo/mageia-dev">More information about the Mageia-dev +mailing list</a><br> +</body></html> |